2nd Time POnly Playback in Finale 2014

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HMKirk_2014
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Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:18 am
Finale Version: 2014.5
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Post by HMKirk_2014 » Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:34 pm

I have a tried a few methods, found via Google, to enable playback on certain sections of music within a repeated area, i.e. the trumpet section, Rhythm section, etc., that I have found for older versions of Finale but they do not seem to work on Finale 2014. They work in certain areas but then the playback in other areas selected when setting up the "2nd Time Only" playback play despite being assigned the created expression tool for to handle the tacit and playback. I can't seem to find any updated instructions for accomplishing this. Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
Thanks,
Mark

Windows 10, 64bit, 8G RAM, Quad Core 3.30 GHz, Finale 2014.5
Cakewalk SONAR X3 Producer, Scarlett 2i2 Interface, M-Audio Oxygen61 and Yamaha P-35 Digital Midi Keyboard controllers, and a Mio midi to USB converter for the Yamaha-to-PC


HMKirk_2014
Posts: 37
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:18 am
Finale Version: 2014.5
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Post by HMKirk_2014 » Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:35 pm

Sorry for the typing error. It should read 2nd Time Only Playback in Finale 2014
Thanks,
Mark

Windows 10, 64bit, 8G RAM, Quad Core 3.30 GHz, Finale 2014.5
Cakewalk SONAR X3 Producer, Scarlett 2i2 Interface, M-Audio Oxygen61 and Yamaha P-35 Digital Midi Keyboard controllers, and a Mio midi to USB converter for the Yamaha-to-PC

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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Tue Sep 09, 2014 4:12 am

Does the problem happen in all documents - or only in some, specific documents?

What playback device are you using?
- MIDI (SmartMusic SoftSynth)?
- VST/Audio Units (e. g. Garritan)?
HMKirk_2014 wrote:I have a tried a few methods, found via Google, to enable playback on certain sections of music within a repeated area, i.e. the trumpet section, Rhythm section, etc., that I have found for older versions of Finale but they do not seem to work on Finale 2014. They work in certain areas but then the playback in other areas selected when setting up the "2nd Time Only" playback play despite being assigned the created expression tool for to handle the tacit and playback…
Did you use the same playback device in the older Finale versions?
Mac OS X 12.6.9 (Monterey), Finale user since 1996

HMKirk_2014
Posts: 37
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:18 am
Finale Version: 2014.5
Operating System: Windows

Post by HMKirk_2014 » Tue Sep 09, 2014 1:36 pm

This is the first document I've used the "2ndTimeOnly" expression tool creations. I've only used the 2014 version as I am new to Finale and I am using the VST - Garritan Instruments with the KS attached to the instrument's name (i.e. - JazzTrumpetKS). It seems to work on the first two measures of a 16 bar section. There are one measure rests present between the note areas however. I also dragged down for 9 instruments, three trumpets and four bones, but the "play 2nd time" only worked on the first three instruments and then, as I mentioned earlier, for the first few measures then in about the fifth measure it started playing again (this is the 1st time through the passage). I'm sure I am doing something incorrectly but I just can't figure out what. Also, do I drag through only one section of instruments, i.e. - trpts, at a time? Do I need to highlight all measures or only, as the directions I got off Google state, the first measure of the section I want to play 2nd time only? Here are the directions I followed:
Question
How can I make a part play only the second time through a repeat?

Answer
To play a part the second time only, follow the steps below:
1. Select the Expression Tool and double-click on the first note of the repeat section in the staff you want silent the first time through.
2. Switch to the Miscellaneous category.
3. Click Create Misc Expression.
4. In the text window type in "tacet first time," "mute," or something similar.
5. Switch to the Playback tab.
6. Set Type to Key Velocity.
7. Under Effect, set the Set to Value to 0.
8. Set Play Only on Pass to 1.
9. Click OK, then Assign.
10. To hide the Mute expression, right or ctrl + click on the marking and uncheck Show.
11. Double-click the first note of the second time through, in the same staff.
12. Make sure the Miscellaneous category is selected, then click Create.
13. In the text window type in "play second time only" or something similar.
14. Switch to the Playback tab.
15. Set Type to Key Velocity.
16. Under Effect, set the Set to Value to 64 (or another number depending on the dynamic you want).
17. Set Play Only on Pass to 2.
18. Click OK, then Assign.
Note: This will also work for first time only playback. Simply reverse the above steps.
Thanks in advance for all your help! :)
Thanks,
Mark

Windows 10, 64bit, 8G RAM, Quad Core 3.30 GHz, Finale 2014.5
Cakewalk SONAR X3 Producer, Scarlett 2i2 Interface, M-Audio Oxygen61 and Yamaha P-35 Digital Midi Keyboard controllers, and a Mio midi to USB converter for the Yamaha-to-PC

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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Tue Sep 09, 2014 10:39 pm

HMKirk_2014 wrote:…then the playback in other areas selected…
HMKirk_2014 wrote:…I also dragged down for 9 instruments, three trumpets and four bones…
HMKirk_2014 wrote:…Also, do I drag through only one section of instruments, i.e. - trpts, at a time? Do I need to highlight all measures or only, as the directions I got off Google state, the first measure of the section I want to play 2nd time only? Here are the directions I followed:…
From your descriptions it sounds like you are selecting a region (perhaps with the Selection Tool?).
However, in the directions you quoted, I can not find anything about selecting a region???
Am I missing something?
If I misunderstand you, then I apologize.
HMKirk_2014 wrote:…2. Switch to the Miscellaneous category.
3. Click Create Misc Expression.…
Perhaps it is just me, but I find it more convenient to create a new expression category, and customize the new category.
HMKirk_2014 wrote:…5. Switch to the Playback tab.
6. Set Type to Key Velocity.
7. Under Effect, set the Set to Value to 0..…
Setting the Key Velocity to 0 works for playback through MIDI, but not for VST (I think).
Instead I would e. g. assign a Pass to an un-used channel.
Then, change it back.
Mac OS X 12.6.9 (Monterey), Finale user since 1996

HMKirk_2014
Posts: 37
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:18 am
Finale Version: 2014.5
Operating System: Windows

Post by HMKirk_2014 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:09 am

Thanks Peter! I'm not sure how to do what you suggested:

[quote]"Setting the Key Velocity to 0 works for playback through MIDI, but not for VST (I think).
Instead I would e. g. assign a Pass to an un-used channel.
Then, change it back."][/quote

I did find a video online (The Finale Projects by Tom Carruth). It seems I can't send you the link because it's triggering a word filter. His method did work briefly on the first group for a number of measures until I reached a "rest section" of more than two measures then it stopped working. I also was unable to assign the two created expressions to other areas in the score. I feel I may be doing something wrong but this video is also using Finale 2011. If you wouldn't mind looking at it and letting me know if there is a way to alter this to work with Finale 2014 I would be very appreciative.

Thanks,
Mark
Thanks,
Mark

Windows 10, 64bit, 8G RAM, Quad Core 3.30 GHz, Finale 2014.5
Cakewalk SONAR X3 Producer, Scarlett 2i2 Interface, M-Audio Oxygen61 and Yamaha P-35 Digital Midi Keyboard controllers, and a Mio midi to USB converter for the Yamaha-to-PC

HMKirk_2014
Posts: 37
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2014 2:18 am
Finale Version: 2014.5
Operating System: Windows

Post by HMKirk_2014 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:12 am

Hi Peter,
I'll try sending the link again:
youtube.com/watch?v=xgUOoGZSiLs

Hopefully this will go through
Thanks,
Mark
Thanks,
Mark

Windows 10, 64bit, 8G RAM, Quad Core 3.30 GHz, Finale 2014.5
Cakewalk SONAR X3 Producer, Scarlett 2i2 Interface, M-Audio Oxygen61 and Yamaha P-35 Digital Midi Keyboard controllers, and a Mio midi to USB converter for the Yamaha-to-PC

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Peter Thomsen
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Finale Version: Finale v27.4
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:52 am

HMKirk_2014 wrote:Thanks Peter! I'm not sure how to do what you suggested…
Take a look at this screen shot:
ExpressionDesigner.jpg
ExpressionDesigner.jpg (31.07 KiB) Viewed 6188 times
In this particular document I have made sure that Channel 10 is not in use (look in the ScoreManager).
By changing the channel to 10 I can make the staff silent.



2 comments to Tom Carruth’s video:

1) For MIDI playback I would not use Key Velocity, but rather Controller 11 (Expression).

2) For VST playback, setting Modulation to zero does not work for me neither.
Mac OS X 12.6.9 (Monterey), Finale user since 1996

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