Finale Forum

I work in Finale 2011 and I need to place a G-key with two sharps upside down in the score, on the end of each staff.
I think that it should be possible by creating a shape in the expression tool, but although it is no problem to make a nice G-key and sharps there, I can't get it upside down.
Does anybody know how to do this?

Welcome to the forum!

1) The sharp symbol is no problem, since it is rotation symmetric - the sharp symbol looks the same when rotated 180°.

2) When you say “G-key”, I suppose that you do not mean “G key signature”, but rather “G clef” -
“Treble Clef”, right?

Take a look at the attached files (done in Finale 2011).

Is that what you mean?

Thanks for your welcome!
Oh, ofcourse; treble clef is the English term. (I am Dutch, we say G-key.)

I opened your examples, and yes, this is exactly what I mean. I am working on music like that for clarinet and saxophone.
It looks great in your example! How can this be done?

Mozart’s « Der Spiegel » is intended for two players sitting at a table, opposing each other, and having the note sheet lying on the table between them.
Is the principle the same in your music for clarinet and saxophone?


Are you an experienced Finale user?
If the following instructions are not detailed enough, let me know:


1) In my example - Der Spiegel - the G clef is rotated by 180°.
I created the rotated clef as a shape expression.

To rotate text in the Shape Designer:
- In the Shape Designer, draw a line.
- Give the line zero width.
- On the end of the line, create a custom arrowhead. This can be a single font character, a whole load of text or even a mixture of text and shapes.
- Rotate the invisible line to put the text at whatever angle you wish.

Another problem is to flip the clef horizontally - like having the clef at the right end of the system, but not upside down.
For that you will need a customized version of the music font.
If you need to flip a clef horizontally, let me know.


2) To make the layout look “great” you need to do a little more than the clef.
The layout should also look “great” when viewed upside down.
Here are some quick ideas:
- Set the music spacing to a scaling factor of ‘1’ so that all rhythmical values - halfs, quarters, eighths &c. - get the same horizontal spacing.
- Use 180° rotated quarter rest symbols in the lower half of the page.
- Use “old style” eighth rest symbols that are rotation symmetric (= looking the same when rotated by 180°).
- Position note accidental sharps exactly mid-way between two notes.


3) Once you really get to know what Finale can do, it is powerful.
If you do a lot of poking around in my Finale 2011 document, you'll learn some things.
It would take me 3 pages of instructions to teach all of the settings I did, but you can figure it out.


Just for the fun of it I attach another example:
Bach’s cross

Thank you so much, Peter! I just did it!
My piece is supposed to be played like the piece by Mozart, you mention.
It is great that I can create all the necessary signs this way.
Yes, I think I am an experienced Finale-user. I sure am going to love this forum.

I am still working on my mirror-piece and it is going fine. I can turn anything around now without any problems.

You advised me to use an old style eight rest. I would like to do that, but where can I find it?
I don't see it anywhere in Maestro.

Margriet wrote:…You advised me to use an old style eighth rest. I would like to do that, but where can I find it?
I don't see it anywhere in Maestro.

If you examine my Finale document with Der Spiegel*), you will see that I created the Maestro font {old style eighth rest} by adding a shape expression (with a rotated by 180° eighth rest symbol) to each “normal” eighth rest.

Also, you can find the {old style eighth rest} glyph in the Fughetta font, in slot #247.


By The Way:
In my Finale document with Der Spiegel I also used quarter rests totated by 180°, in the lower half of the page.
This means that both performers will see “normal” quarter rests in the upper half of their page.


*)When you view the Finale document with Der Spiegel, you should not only view the score, but also view the linked parts.

Thank you again!