stem lengths

[gdelanghe]

I have Finale 25.0.0.6858 Windows 10
I know standard stem lengths are octaves or 3.5 spaces
However, when beaming notes (eg 1/8 notes) the stem lengths shorten under certain beaming conditions.
My example has 3 1/8th notes.
Measure 1: all 3 notes beamed, stems extend octave
Measure 2: first 2 notes beamed, stems an octave
Measure 3: last 2 notes beamed have shortened stems
Measure 4 is how I thought the beams would be (all octave)

Is there a rule of notation I need to know here? As to why the measure 3, beamed 1/8 notes are shorter?

[Peter Thomsen]

Take a look at

Document menu > Document Options > Beams

These beam settings are document specific, so you can have different settings in different documents.

I suggest that you

- read in the online manual about the options in {Document Options - Beams} (= what they do),

- experiment with the settings - to see how different settings affect the layout.

[gdelanghe]

My query is why Finale shortens the stems in the 3rd measure. There must be some rule of notation here, otherwise the stems would be 3.5 spaces/octave. Why the stunted stems?

[gdelanghe]

I used the beam angle tool to lengthen the stems in the 4th measure to 3.5 spaces/octave. Is there a setting to achieve this globally in the document, or, is their a notation rule accounting for the stunted stems in measure 3?

[gdelanghe]

If I flatten all beams, stems are 3.5 spaces.
Any other setting stunts stems in 3rd measure:
Base on end notes only
Flatten beams based on standard note
Flatten beams based on extreme note

[gdelanghe]

Here's the two settings:
Flatten all beams
Base slope on end notes only

[Peter Thomsen]

gdelanghe,

Some of the things you tell, are not true.

… My example has 3 1/8th notes.
Measure 1: all 3 notes beamed, stems extend octave …

The stem on the ‘a’ extends octave.

… Measure 2: first 2 notes beamed, stems an octave …

The stem on the ‘f’ is an octave - the stem on the ‘a’ is longer.

… Measure 4 is how I thought the beams would be (all octave) …

You probably mean the stems, not the beams.
The stems are not “all octave” - the stem on the ‘g’ is an octave, but the stem on the ‘a’ is longer.

… If I flatten all beams, stems are 3.5 spaces …

Some of the stems are 3.5 Spaces - some stems are longer.
All the beams are horizontal.

… Any other setting stunts stems in 3rd measure:
Base on end notes only
Flatten beams based on standard note
Flatten beams based on extreme note …

If you understand you correctly, you have only been experimenting with the settings in the pop up menu Beaming Style, right?

You have not been experimenting with the other settings, like e. g. “Allow Primary Beam Within a Space”, or “Maximum Slope”, right?

… Is there a rule of notation I need to know here? …

Different engravings follow different rules.
Obviously that is the reason why there are so many options in a Finale document.

From your postings I get the impression that you are trying to give as many stems as possible a stem length of 3.5 Spaces.
Take a look at the attached examples (attached both as a graphic and as a Finale document).
Is this what you are trying to do?

[gdelanghe]

I personally am fine with the stem lengths that are shortened. I'm notating bagpipe music and the client finds those stems "stunted". Finale shortened them in that instance, but I don't know why. If there is a rule of notation covering that, I'm good with it. If there isn't, I guess I need to set all stems for 3.5
I'm aware of the usual stem rules like note heads in ledger lines extending to middle line etc.
I just didn't know why finale shortened those stems

[Peter Thomsen]

… Finale shortened them in that instance, but I don't know why. If there is a rule of notation covering that, I'm good with it …

Actually there are two settings (or “rules” if you prefer that term) involved:

- Allow Primary Beam Within a Space
In some engravings it is selected, in other engravings it is de-selected.

- Maximum Slope
In some engravings the value is higher, in other engravings it is lower.

Did you examine the settings in the Finale document I attached?

[gdelanghe]

I'll check your attachments tonight. I'm on the iPhone now.
Thanks, George

[gdelanghe]

Allow primary beam within a space did it. Thanks.
But, is there an explanation as to why those stems were shortened?

[Peter Thomsen]

Allow primary beam within a space did it. Thanks.
But, is there an explanation as to why those stems were shortened?

When “Allow Primary Beam Within a Space” is de-selected, primary beams are not allowed to cross over spaces in the staff.
To avoid that beams cross over spaces in the staff, Finale has to adjust the stem lengths.

[gdelanghe]

Thank you for the help! Invaluable. I was an Encore user, but since using Finale I've totally converted. Evidently, unlike Finale, the people at Passport Designs are not interested in responding to questions (for months!), and haven't upgraded/improved their product in over 2 years. I guess, as they say: "If you snooze, you lose"

Again, thanks for a stellar job!