Finale 25, jazz fonts?

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jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Fri Nov 24, 2017 6:13 pm

Is there a better font than the handwritten one? I tried loading the jazz font but it replaces the up-bow with a glissando:

Before
finalebefore.jpg
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After
finalejazz.jpg
finalejazz.jpg (69.41 KiB) Viewed 11974 times


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zuill
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Post by zuill » Fri Nov 24, 2017 6:29 pm

Odd that the Jazz font has the wrong character in that slot. I've not used that font often, but it seems I would have encountered that omission over the past 20+ years. You should send a note to MakeMusic so they can fix it.

Anyway, the Broadway Copyist font has the correct upbow character, so you might try that.

Again, strange shortcoming of the Jazz Font.

Zuill
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jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:49 pm

i tried the broadway font and it did not have the same issue but also doesn't look like a jazz font.

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N Grossingink
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Post by N Grossingink » Sat Nov 25, 2017 1:21 pm

Here is the Jazz accent rotated 90º - a Shape Expression arrowhead imported into the Articulation Tool. You can copy it from the attached file into one of your files if you want to play around with it.

N.
Upbow.png
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N. Grossingink
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jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:15 pm

That's a cool workaround but I've got literally thousands of exercises that I'd have to edit to fix this.

No word from MM yet.
N Grossingink wrote:Here is the Jazz accent rotated 90º - a Shape Expression arrowhead imported into the Articulation Tool. You can copy it from the attached file into one of your files if you want to play around with it.

N.
Upbow.png

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:15 pm

Is there another jazz font I can purchase that will have the correct articulations and that looks better than broadway? Broadway Sebelius-ish to me...

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elbsound
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Post by elbsound » Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:39 pm

The (free) Elbsound Music Font Package for Finale includes four jazz fonts which are fully (!) compatible with Maestro:
LijazFIN, ImprvFIN, GldngFIN and JzBscFIN.
Download: https://elbsound.studio/elbsound-music- ... finale.php

All symbols in these fonts:
Image

Swap the fonts in Finale - the spacing and layout will be hardly affected:
Image
Last edited by elbsound on Sat Nov 25, 2017 5:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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zuill
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Post by zuill » Sat Nov 25, 2017 4:54 pm

As far as the Jazz Font, I started a ticket with MakeMusic. Let's see what they have to say about the missing upbow.

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elbsound
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Post by elbsound » Sat Nov 25, 2017 5:26 pm

In Jazz Font you can use symbol 118 for up bow:
upbow jazz.jpg
upbow jazz.jpg (18.72 KiB) Viewed 11899 times
There are many places where the Jazz Font is not fully compatible with Maestro.
The Elbsound package fonts are 100% compatible with Maestro.

BuonTempi
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Post by BuonTempi » Sat Nov 25, 2017 6:19 pm

Jazz font was licensed by MakeMusic from a third-party, and they do not have permission to change it. The lack of movement on updating it was why they made Broadway instead.
There are many problems with Jazz font, and by all accounts they will not be fixed.

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Sat Nov 25, 2017 11:28 pm

elbsound wrote:In Jazz Font you can use symbol 118 for up bow:
upbow jazz.jpg
There are many places where the Jazz Font is not fully compatible with Maestro.
The Elbsound package fonts are 100% compatible with Maestro.
For some reason, they look grainy and the articulations for up and down stroke look particularly bad. They also don't display with font names in the fonts dialog and instead show a random sampling of symbol characters and appear extremely grainy as if they are not aliased. Unless I'm either doing something very wrong or finale is treating them very wrong, I can't see how they would be useful for any type of printed publication.

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Sat Nov 25, 2017 11:29 pm

i messaged sigler asking about it and also submitted a ticket to finale but didn't get an acknowledgement back from either party...

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elbsound
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Post by elbsound » Sun Nov 26, 2017 1:05 pm

>they look grainy and the articulations for up and down stroke look particularly bad.
Which of the 25 Elbsound fonts are you talking of?

>They appear extremely grainy as if they are not aliased.
Hm, if you look at the high resolution PDF of the Elbsound fonts created from within Finale( https://elbsound.studio/download.php?f= ... ymbols.pdf ), it doesn't look grainy.
Here is a screencam comparison of Maestro, LijazFIN and ImprvFIN in Finale at a high resolution:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCRtU_eMM8M
They don't look different regarding grain, do they?
On Windows TTF fonts in general look more sharp, but slightly pixelated, while OTF fonts seem more smooth, but slightly unsharp.
Maybe you need to change the format?

>They also don't display with font names in the fonts dialog and instead show a random sampling of symbol characters
That's a Finale bug which also appears on of Finale's own fonts (see for example Maestro in the video above). It's also a prove that the Elbsound font encoding is more compatible with Maestro than the Jazz Font.

>Unless I'm either doing something very wrong or finale is treating them very wrong
Can you post a screenshot of the problem?

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:10 am

i'm using the TT font and this looks pretty bad to me.

Both in terms of grainyness as well as actual shape of the articulations... It looks better printed than onscreen but overall the look and feel just is not aesthetically pleasing. Is there a font with the same feel and character as the finale supplied jazz font? I previewed 5 or 6 and they all looked clown-like.
imprvfin.jpg
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MikeHalloran
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Post by MikeHalloran » Mon Nov 27, 2017 4:00 pm

I can’t imagine doing string exercises in a jazz font. If doing it for oneself, whatever floats your boat.

If planning to sell it, one should consider the potential customer. As a former strings teacher, I would dismiss any handwritten style notation font as a silly affectation and wouldn’t give it a second look. If it was being marketed as a an exercise book for the jazz violinist, maybe...

Yea, Broadway Copyist isn’t the Jazz font. This is a good thing. As has been pointed out, Jazz Font will never do what you want. I gave up on it years ago over the same issue — I used to write out exercises for my guitar students and the same symbols are used for up/down pick. It would never occur to me to use it for my cello and bass students (or Broadway for that matter).

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elbsound
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Post by elbsound » Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:09 pm

jzucker, there must be something wrong with your system. Even your Maestro font looks very grainy in your first image.
Could it be that you have switched off the Windows font smoothing functions (although I don't know if they affect Finale) or that you're working at the wrong monitor resolution ?

If you compare your images with the screencam video I posted, you'll notice the difference.

If you don't like the handwritten fonts, there are many more that work in Finale.
Here are images from about 30 handwritten fonts in Finale: https://elbsound.studio/music-font-comp ... t=AshMusic
But there are many more (though not all are fully compatible with Maestro):
RealScore, BopMusic, TTkJazz, SPP Jazz, Aloisen Groove, NorMusik, Soli, JazzCopyist, PriMusJazz, Tune Up JNL, Roemer, RealScore, BigBand, BopMusic, HandClap, Steinberg Notat Jazz, Encore NorMusic, ForteFolk, ForteInk and ForteJazz.

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:30 am

i did have font smoothing turned off for performance reasons and yes, it looks less grainy with font smoothing turned on but the articulations and sharps still have a funny appearance almost as if a little kid wrote them. Which one is closest to the jazz font? I actually love the jazz font other than the extended char mapping.

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:32 am

p.s. ashmusic and several of the other fonts on your page look just like what I'm looking for. I'll figure out which one will work and make a donation. Thanks very much for all your help and hard work!!!
elbsound wrote:jzucker, there must be something wrong with your system. Even your Maestro font looks very grainy in your first image.
Could it be that you have switched off the Windows font smoothing functions (although I don't know if they affect Finale) or that you're working at the wrong monitor resolution ?

If you compare your images with the screencam video I posted, you'll notice the difference.

If you don't like the handwritten fonts, there are many more that work in Finale.
Here are images from about 30 handwritten fonts in Finale: https://elbsound.studio/music-font-comp ... t=AshMusic
But there are many more (though not all are fully compatible with Maestro):
RealScore, BopMusic, TTkJazz, SPP Jazz, Aloisen Groove, NorMusik, Soli, JazzCopyist, PriMusJazz, Tune Up JNL, Roemer, RealScore, BigBand, BopMusic, HandClap, Steinberg Notat Jazz, Encore NorMusic, ForteFolk, ForteInk and ForteJazz.

jzucker
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Post by jzucker » Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:37 am

how do I download the ashmusic font? The external font link takes me to a full program download for Encore...

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elbsound
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Post by elbsound » Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:38 am

You probably didn't click on the AshMusic link (which actually doesn't exist as this font isn't sold anymore), but on the link for the "B" font Anastasia which is included in Encore. I have updated the script now, so that it is more clear that the link doesn't exist.

Many fonts are not available individually, but only bundled with notation software - for example Anastasia with Encore. So you need to (buy if necessary,) download and install the notation software and will get the fonts.

The Elbsound jazz font that resembles Finale's Jazz font most is the Lilypond based LilyJazz / LijazFIN font.
https://elbsound.studio/music-font-comp ... t=LijazFIN

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