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No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

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No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby Kaththeamac » Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:10 pm

Hi,
I need to do a lead sheet with no time signature at all - measures vary (1st measure 8 beats, 2nd 6 beats, 3rd 12 beats, 4th 10 beats, etc).
Is this possible, and if so, how?
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby miker » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:09 am

Welcome to the Forum.

You can't do that in PM, sorry. You would need the full Finale.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby AndrewGraham » Sun Jan 15, 2017 2:56 pm

Hi,
I have Finale 2014, and I want to do what Keththeamac asks, i.e. have no time signature, and a varying number of quarter and eighth notes in each measure. Apparently it's doable (see miker's response) but I have no idea how. Any ideas?
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby miker » Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:27 pm

Set up each measure with the time signature that you need, and enter the notes. Then, select the measures, and from the context menu, choose Edit Measure Attributes. In the next screen, set Time Signature>Always Hide, OK.

Remember, this is for the full Finale, only!
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong - “full Finale”

Postby Peter Thomsen » Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:45 pm

miker wrote:… and from the context menu, choose Edit Measure Attributes …

Power user trick to open the Measure Attributes:
Instead of going via the context menu, double-click the selected.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby motet » Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:48 pm

Unfortunately with that method you are left with unwanted space between notes where the barlines used to be. You can get rid of the extra space at the beginning of the measures in question one by one, but that doesn't completely eliminate it. Better, I think, to plan the whole system to be one measure of 27/4 or whatever and hide that. There was a JW plug-in that merged several measures into one instead of having to count (JW Meter and Rhythm), but perhaps it's moribund now.

I understand this is extremely easy with Dorico.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby miker » Sun Jan 15, 2017 5:23 pm

I was illustrating it as the OP asked: multiple measures with differing numbers of beats. For one long measure, use Motet's suggestion of an overlarge time sig. No need to hide the barlines, either way.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby AndrewGraham » Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:38 am

Thanks for this. Setting the time signature according to the number of beats in each bar works. However, I don't seem to have the option to hide it. I'm using version 2014.0820.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby miker » Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:49 am

Yes, you do. Look in the measure attributes dialogue box. You will see the choice to Display Time Signature, and choose "never." (I think it's in the lower left, but Windows may be a little different from Mac.)

You are using Finale, and not PrintMusic, right?
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby AndrewGraham » Thu Jan 19, 2017 2:51 pm

Oops. Maybe I don't have the full Finale, but rather PrintMusic. The edit attribute box just has barline types. I suspect that I may be out of luck.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby miker » Thu Jan 19, 2017 4:53 pm

That's what it sounds like. Sorry for any confusion.
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby Luka Puka » Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:40 am

I was actually going to ask this but I found this instead.

There should be an update/plugin (or new mechanic in the next generation of the full Finale) where you can make a piece time signature-less, similar to how Finale offers a "keyless" option in the new document setup wizard.

Every time you added a note, the measure would automatically lengthen indefinitely until you were done entering notes. Grouping of notes in irregular patterns with the special tools palette would be a pain, though. However, things like copy + paste would stay the same. Key and clef changes would look really awkward considering the flats and sharps or clefs would just be there on a staff without barlines before or after them.

In music we're so used to having barlines and whatnot. Sometimes breaking the rules is fun, even if you lose your sense of "pulse" in music...
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Re: No time signature - like plainsong (PrintMusic PC)

Postby miker » Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:06 am

But that would surely be a feature only in full Finale, and not in PrintMusic, which is where the question was posed. You can already have "timeless" music in Finale, although not quite so seamlessly as you propose.
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