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Jianpu(numbered notation) for finale
Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 4:11 am
by ctytom
Hello,
I'm using Finale2012. Is there any plugin or solution that the finale score can be convert to jianpu(numbered notation)?
thx a lot
Re: Jianpu(numbered notation) for finale
Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 2:11 pm
by miker
Not as far as I know.
Re: Jianpu (numbered notation) for Finale
Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 3:26 pm
by Peter Thomsen
If I understand you correctly, you are asking for some sort of “automatic” solution - right?
So that you get both layout and playback - right?
I could be wrong, but I do not know of a utility / plug-in that “automatically” can do the conversion for you.
You will have to do the conversion yourself, “manually”.
However, some of Finale’s tools may be of use for you.
* Are you an experienced Finale user?
I am not sure how detailed explanations you need.
1) You can use the Staff Tool to get correct playback from some standard staves that are hidden in the layout.
2) To get correct layout you can use special staves that do not display any of the items you do not need, such as e. g. staff lines, clefs, &c.
This is done with the Staff Tool.
I recommend that you take a look at the ready made template {Lyrics and Chords}.
The {Lyrics and Chords} template only displays lyrics and chord symbols - it does not display anything else.
3) The music notation can be entered as expressions (shape expressions and/or text expressions).
I would create some custom expression categories for that.
4) Depending on the actual needs you could also use something else than the Expression Tool.
If you do not need chord symbols, you could use the Chord Tool to enter the note names.
There is a special chord style for that.
NB:
Chord styles are document specific.
You can not - in the very same document - also have chord symbols in standard style.
5) If you do not need lyrics, you could try notating the numbers with the Lyrics Tool.
You would still need the Expression Tool for the remainder of the notation, such as e. g. the “octavation dots”.
I can not be more specific until I know, exactly what you need.
An attached graphic would tell a lot.
Re: Jianpu(numbered notation) for finale
Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2021 8:01 pm
by miker
I found this program:
http://debussy.music.ubc.ca/NoteAbility/index.html
It appears to be Mac and iPad only, so it may not be of any use to you. Very strange website, not intuitive at all. I downloaded a demo version, and yes, it can do jianpu. It can also convert jianpu to western notation, and vice-versa. It can import XML files, so it's possible that you could work in Finale, export your XML, and take it into NoteAbility. I didn't spend enough time with it to really run it through its paces, but it seems to work as advertised. I suspect that someone who knows what they are doing can really make it work. The website now says it can be used free of charge. There are help files, but it still took some digging to follow the instructions.
Not a rousing recommendation, to be sure, but it's out there, and it works, as far as I can tell.
Re: Jianpu(numbered notation) for finale
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:10 pm
by ctytom
miker wrote: ↑Sun Jun 27, 2021 8:01 pm
I found this program:
http://debussy.music.ubc.ca/NoteAbility/index.html
It appears to be Mac and iPad only, so it may not be of any use to you. Very strange website, not intuitive at all. I downloaded a demo version, and yes, it can do jianpu. It can also convert jianpu to western notation, and vice-versa. It can import XML files, so it's possible that you could work in Finale, export your XML, and take it into NoteAbility. I didn't spend enough time with it to really run it through its paces, but it seems to work as advertised. I suspect that someone who knows what they are doing can really make it work. The website now says it can be used free of charge. There are help files, but it still took some digging to follow the instructions.
Not a rousing recommendation, to be sure, but it's out there, and it works, as far as I can tell.
thx miker! But I haven't any mac os that can try it. I will ask my friends do a favourite for me.
Re: Jianpu (numbered notation) for Finale
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:24 pm
by ctytom
Peter Thomsen wrote: ↑Sun Jun 27, 2021 3:26 pm
If I understand you correctly, you are asking for some sort of “automatic” solution - right?
So that you get both layout and playback - right?
I could be wrong, but I do not know of a utility / plug-in that “automatically” can do the conversion for you.
You will have to do the conversion yourself, “manually”.
However, some of Finale’s tools may be of use for you.
* Are you an experienced Finale user?
I am not sure how detailed explanations you need.
1) You can use the Staff Tool to get correct
playback from some standard staves that are hidden in the layout.
2) To get correct
layout you can use special staves that do not display any of the items you do not need, such as e. g. staff lines, clefs, &c.
This is done with the Staff Tool.
I recommend that you take a look at the ready made template {Lyrics and Chords}.
The {Lyrics and Chords} template only displays lyrics and chord symbols - it does not display anything else.
3) The music notation can be entered as expressions (shape expressions and/or text expressions).
I would create some custom expression categories for that.
4) Depending on the actual needs you could also use something else than the Expression Tool.
If you do not need chord symbols, you could use the Chord Tool to enter the note names.
There is a special chord style for that.
NB:
Chord styles are document specific.
You can not - in the very same document - also have chord symbols in standard style.
5) If you do not need lyrics, you could try notating the numbers with the Lyrics Tool.
You would still need the Expression Tool for the remainder of the notation, such as e. g. the “octavation dots”.
I can not be more specific until I know, exactly what you need.
An attached graphic would tell a lot.
Hi Mr.Thomsen,
Thx for yr details replies. Since i'm not an experience finale user, but I have to do my composing or arranging full score for chinese orchestral pieces starting from many years ago.
First of all, I make the full score with "5-lines score" in finale. But I have to extract the parts for the musicians and they used to read the scores in "numbered notation"(Jianpu). So the problem is here! finale can only extract the parts in 5-lines score. I and my "score-team" hope to find a easy and effective way which can "translate" the 5-lines score to Jianpu.
the "Jianpu" function we focus on parts only but not on full score. If there is some "automatic-way" of this kind of score translation, it will be more effective and accurate much more than translating by human.
Hope you can give us some hints or solutions about that. Thx a lots.
Re: Jianpu (numbered notation) for Finale
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:42 pm
by Peter Thomsen
ctytom wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:24 pm
… i'm not an experience finale user …
ctytom wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:24 pm
… the "Jianpu" function we focus on parts only but not on full score. If there is some "automatic-way" of this kind of score translation, it will be more effective and accurate much more than translating by human …
Translating from standard 5-line notation to Jianpu is definitely not a task for “Finale beginners”.
But indeed there are some things you can do (even if you “only” have Finale 2012), to make the translation more effective / more accurate.
1) Make a duplicate copy of the Score document.
In this duplicate copy you can experiment, and you always have the original Score document as a “backup copy”, in case something goes wrong.
2) In the duplicate copy, add an extra staff to each part.
This staff will serve as a “translation step” to Jianpu.
3) Set up the extra staff as a (very) special Tablature staff.
If you set up the staff correctly, you can copy music from the standard 5-line staff to the TAB staff, and the resulting TAB notation will be very close to real Jianpu.
4) The idea is that you set up the TAB staff as a “fretboard instrument” with 8 diatonic frets tuned in the Concert Pitch key of the actual sounding music (perhaps the key of C Major?).
Each string on this (very special) “fretboard instrument” = one octave in Jianpu notation = all the pitches that have the same “octavation dots”.
In Other Words:
If your Jianpu spans 3 octaves (= 3 different “octavation dot regions”), then the (very special) “fretboard instrument” should have 3 strings.
You will not, “automatically” get “octavation dots” in this TAB notation, but pitches in different octaves will appear on different strings in the TAB.
Re: Jianpu (numbered notation) for Finale
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 2:15 pm
by ctytom
Peter Thomsen wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:42 pm
ctytom wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:24 pm
… i'm not an experience finale user …
ctytom wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:24 pm
… the "Jianpu" function we focus on parts only but not on full score. If there is some "automatic-way" of this kind of score translation, it will be more effective and accurate much more than translating by human …
Translating from standard 5-line notation to Jianpu is definitely not a task for “Finale beginners”.
But indeed there are some things you can do (even if you “only” have Finale 2012), to make the translation more effective / more accurate.
1) Make a duplicate copy of the Score document.
In this duplicate copy you can experiment, and you always have the original Score document as a “backup copy”, in case something goes wrong.
2) In the duplicate copy, add an extra staff to each part.
This staff will serve as a “translation step” to Jianpu.
3) Set up the extra staff as a (very) special Tablature staff.
If you set up the staff correctly, you can copy music from the standard 5-line staff to the TAB staff, and the resulting TAB notation will be very close to real Jianpu.
4) The idea is that you set up the TAB staff as a “fretboard instrument” with 8 diatonic frets tuned in the Concert Pitch key of the actual sounding music (perhaps the key of C Major?).
Each string on this (very special) “fretboard instrument” = one octave in Jianpu notation = all the pitches that have the same “octavation dots”.
In Other Words:
If your Jianpu spans 3 octaves (= 3 different “octavation dot regions”), then the (very special) “fretboard instrument” should have 3 strings.
You will not, “automatically” get “octavation dots” in this TAB notation, but pitches in different octaves will appear on different strings in the TAB.
really thx for your reply. But I think the "fretboard instrument solution" is not the suitable for us. Here I upload an example. That's the result we are look for.
The numbered notation is input manually with another software which can only input "numbered notation".
Re: Jianpu(numbered notation) for finale
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 2:27 pm
by ctytom
for the Jianpu system, "1" is not strictly refer to C4. Let me share a little bit about Jianpu and numbered notation.
In jianpu system, first of all, we read the score and which MAJOR belongs to. There is no MINOR in Jianpu system. E.G. 5-line-score with G-clef without any accidental, the song maybe in C-major or A-minor. But in Jianpu, this will only come out in C-major.
Secondly, after we find out the song which major belongs to, than the tonic will be marked as 1 and dominant will be marked as 5, etc. The note duration will be marked using the notes' underline. And the Octave will be marked using the dot. One dot will be added on the note if the note is one upper octave. One dot will be added under the note if the note is one lower octave.
Re: Jianpu(numbered notation) for finale
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 3:15 pm
by miker
Since the app I mentioned above has an iPad version, maybe you should consider buying an iPad. You could still do your Western notation in Finale, and just bring it into iPad for converting.