Multiple Movements in one Document

[BASS01123]

I'm running Mac 2012. I am attempting to create a setting of a chant, which will take up about a third of the opening page of the work .. then, on the rest of the first page, I would like to start the motet built on said chant in SATB voicing. Since the chant is constructed by using stemless eighth and quarter notes, placed in long (page wide) measures with time sigs like 36/8, or whatever is needed ...this is a big change from what the rest of the piece has to be. I think it's probably dealing with two movements in one document ... but try as I may, I can't seem to make the first page look the way I want ... I.e, five or so lines of chant, then a space, then a normal Choral score for the rest of the first page. Attached (well, I tried)is the beginning few lines of the chant part of the first page ... haven't got a clue as to how to begin with the rest of the piece after the chant lines are complete. Help!



If you can help .... I'd appreciate it ...

thanks, Dean

[Peter Thomsen]

…Attached (well, I tried)is the beginning few lines of the chant part of the first page ... haven't got a clue as to how to begin with the rest of the piece after the chant lines are complete…

Welcome to the forum!

It looks like you did not attach the Finale document.

Before you can attach a Finale document in this forum, you must compress it, e. g. as a .zip file.
And the file size must not be more than max. 100 KB.

[BASS01123]

Here is my compressed file, mentioned in my last post ..

Dean

[miker]

Have you tried the "score merger" feature? Details in the help files.

[BASS01123]

I will check out the Score Merger feature ... thanks.

Dean

[Peter Thomsen]

Dean M. Estabrook,

Take a look at the attached demo document.

Is that what you have in mind?

[BASS01123]

Yes, that's very much what I wanted .... how did you do it?

Dean

[Peter Thomsen]

1) If you look at my demo document in Scroll View, you will see that there are four staves throughout the document.
In the first 5 systems three of the staves are removed via a custom staff style I have called "Force Hide Staff (Collapse)".

2) In the first 4 systems the remaining staff (= the Tenor staff) is set to, not display time signatures,
via a custom staff style I have called "Chant Staff".

3) In the 5th system I have made the Tenor staff, not display anything at all, via a custom staff style I have called "Hide Everything".
This system (= only one measure) serves as space before Movement 2.
The movement title is an expression attached to this "non-displaying" staff/measure.

4) You can study my custom staff styles by going to
Staff menu > Define Staff Styles…
Tip: If you, in the Staff menu, select "Show Staff Styles" and "Show Staff Style Names", my demo document will be more clear.
(Staff styles and staff style names are only shown when you are in the Staff Tool)

5) In the last measure of the chant (= in the 4th system), in the Measure Attributes, the right barline is set to be a so called Final Barline.

6) In the last measure before Movement 2 (= in the "non-displaying" system), in the Measure Attributes, the option "Hide Cautionary Clefs, Key and Time Signatures" is selected.

I hope that this is clear?
If not, ask again.

[BASS01123]

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain this ... It's going to take some study on my part, so here I go ...

Take Care,


Dean

[BASS01123]

Hi Peter .... upon studying what you did, inre this action:
In the first 5 systems three of the staves are removed via a custom staff style I have called "Force Hide Staff (Collapse)".

I don't understand how you accomplished the "collapsing" technique ...

Dean

[Peter Thomsen]

Hi Dean,

1) Open my demo document "Salve Regina.mus".

2) Staff Tool.
Staff menu > Define Staff Styles…

3) In the pop up menu of Available Staff Styles (= the staff styles I created for this document),
choose "Force Hide Staff(Collapse)".
You can see how my staff style is defined.
When I had created this staff style, I applied it to the S, A, and B staves in the first 5 systems.
The staff style removed the staves from the first 5 systems, leaving only the T staff (= the Chant Staff).

4) Similarly I used a custom made staff style I called "Chant Staff", to hide time signatures from the T staff
in the first 4 systems.

5) Similarly I used a custom made staff style I called "Hide Everything", to make the T staff display nothing
in the 5th system.

[Paul Inwood]

Isn't it much easier just to start off with four staves throughout and simply hide the unwanted staves in the first systems with the staff tool? And then hide the time signature in those measures using the measure tool for each one? Saves a lot of time over creating staff styles, etc.

Also, if Dean wants to end up with stemless noteheads, as he mentioned in his OP, he'll need to use quarters, not eighths (because the flags are still visible with eighths when you hide the stems).

[BASS01123]

Danke Gentlemen ... This is giving me a lot upon which to chew ... I'll get it sooner or later ... appreciate the time taken!

Dean

[Peter Thomsen]

…if Dean wants to end up with stemless noteheads, as he mentioned in his OP, he'll need to use quarters, not eighths (because the flags are still visible with eighths when you hide the stems).

In which Finale version is it that "the flags are still visible with eighths, when you hide the stems"?

Dean is using Finale 2011.
In my own copy of Finale 2011 I am unable to duplicate the problem that "the flags are still visible with eighths, when you hide the stems".

I tried to hide the stems in two different ways:

a) with a staff style (Stemless Notes),

b) with the Special Tools Tool's sub-tool Custom Stem Tool, replacing the stem with an empty shape, created in the Shape Designer.

In both cases the flags disappeared with the stems.

[Paul Inwood]

…if Dean wants to end up with stemless noteheads, as he mentioned in his OP, he'll need to use quarters, not eighths (because the flags are still visible with eighths when you hide the stems).

In which Finale version is it that "the flags are still visible with eighths, when you hide the stems"?

Dean is using Finale 2011.
In my own copy of Finale 2011 I am unable to duplicate the problem that "the flags are still visible with eighths, when you hide the stems".

I tried to hide the stems in two different ways:

a) with a staff style (Stemless Notes),

b) with the Special Tools Tool's sub-tool Custom Stem Tool, replacing the stem with an empty shape, created in the Shape Designer.

In both cases the flags disappeared with the stems.

Absolutely correct. But there are two other methods, neither of which removes the flags:

(1) Special Tools: Stem Length Tool (the quickest and easiest way to remove stems: just drag the stem handle to vanishing point)
(2) Document Options: Stems, then change all Stem Lengths to zero (You wouldn't use that in the present case because not all the score will be stemless)

NB for anyone who was going to try this: the Special Tools' sub-tool Custom Stem Tool replaces the stem with an empty shape, but if the eighth note is beamed the beam remains.

[BASS01123]

Actually, I'm using 2012 ... for whatever that's worth ...


Dean

[BASS01123]

Looking at this screen shot ... I have a sort of mix and match as to when to beam, and when not to beam ... anyone know the lastest rules as to when to properly do this ..

Thanks,

Dean

oh well, the Zip was too large ... sorry about that ...

[BASS01123]

Mac question ... all of the sudden today, Open Apple Z does not undo an action ... what could cause it?


Dean

[miker]

Restart the computer. That solves a lot of those "all of a sudden" issues.

[BASS01123]

Thanks for the restart thought .... why did I not try that? ... it worked! Next question: I'm working on a document with 5 staffs ... SSATBB ... How am I able to have say, the men's staves in 3/4 meter, and the women's in 6/8 at the same time?

Thanks,

Dean

[miker]

I would put them all in 6/8, with the men set to display as 3/4. You can adjust the beaming options as desired.

[BASS01123]

Uh, make that six staves ....

Duh ..

[BASS01123]

"I would put them all in 6/8, with the men set to display as 3/4. You can adjust the beaming options as desired."

Yes, I was going to adjust the beaming to do that, but how do you "set to display as 3/4? " Besides with the beaming, that is ...


thanks for the response ...


Dean

[miker]

I'm wrong. (Computer is in the shop.) You have to allow Independent Time Signature, in the staff attributes screen.

Sorry for the confusion.

[michelp]

Assuming that the basic time signature is 3/4, go to the Staff Attributes of each staff you want in 6/8 and select Independent Elements -> Time Signature.
Then use the time signature tool for each of these staves to define 6/8 (if you like 2 groups of 3 beamed eight notes, define the 6/8 with 2 dotted quarter notes).
If needed, click on More choices -> Use a different Time Signature for Display.

PS : for the sake of clarity, it would be better to create a new thread each time you have a new question.
PS 2 : I realize that miker was faster in giving you the same answer.