O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

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Michel R E
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O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by Michel R E » Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:15 am

I have a string part, all in long-note tremolo, pp.
I would like certain moments to receive a slight emphasis. It's not an accent, it's just adding a tiny bit more weight on that first beat .
would it be understood if I added a tenuto line above the note? (which already has the tremolo articulation)

in French I would say those notes are to be "appuyer".

*******************************************************************
A second question, in case someone knows the answer:

I have accented (forte) open string double-stops, they're staccato, quarter notes on beats 1 and 3 (in a fast 4/4, it's almost a 2/2).
I would like them off the string, and for the string to continue vibrating.
I seem to recall reading that I should avoid using the LV indication (or the little tie that leads nowhere) in string writing.
But that seems to best desrcibe what I want.
Any suggestions?
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

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David Ward
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by David Ward » Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:14 am

Michel R E wrote:… … A second question, in case someone knows the answer:

I have accented (forte) open string double-stops, they're staccato, quarter notes on beats 1 and 3 (in a fast 4/4, it's almost a 2/2).
I would like them off the string, and for the string to continue vibrating.
I seem to recall reading that I should avoid using the LV indication (or the little tie that leads nowhere) in string writing.
But that seems to best desrcibe what I want.
Any suggestions?
I don't have an immediate suggestion (or rather I have several different ones, none ideal), but I will be very interested to read if anyone does have a definitive answer.
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by HaraldS » Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:44 pm

Michel R E wrote:I have a string part, all in long-note tremolo, pp.
I would like certain moments to receive a slight emphasis. It's not an accent, it's just adding a tiny bit more weight on that first beat .
would it be understood if I added a tenuto line above the note? (which already has the tremolo articulation)
I suspect you are you using unmeasured tremolo, thus the three-slash-variant, not a measured one (1-slash), where one note is subdivided.
I would doubt that string players would easily understand that notation, as a tremolo marking is associated with fast bow movement (start direction and speed is up to the player) where tenuto is usually associated with a slower, definetly controlled bow movement. To me, it sounds a bit contradictory. If you are there and can explain what you mean, it would work, of course.

But if that should work without your personal presence, I would suggest using the notation like e.g. Schubert (Example): he writes a dynamic and a decrescendo. That dynamic can be a strong or a moderate one (and could contain "subito") and the decresc. could be long or short, but he achieves to give the player a visual idea of the desired audible result.
Michel R E wrote:in French I would say those notes are to be "appuyer".
Il faut appuyer les notes, mais il ne faut pas appuyer sur le champignon ;)!
Michel R E wrote:I have accented (forte) open string double-stops, they're staccato, quarter notes on beats 1 and 3 (in a fast 4/4, it's almost a 2/2).
I would like them off the string, and for the string to continue vibrating.
I seem to recall reading that I should avoid using the LV indication (or the little tie that leads nowhere) in string writing.
But that seems to best desrcibe what I want.
Any suggestions?
L.V. or laissez vibrer sounds reasonably and perfectly clear to me. If I remember right, when I rehearsed a piece of mine with a violinist and explained to him the same result you're mentioning, he indicated "l.v." in his part.
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Michel R E
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by Michel R E » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:07 pm

the Schubert example is sort of what I was looking for, except the dynamic change I need is much shorter and not pronounced.
I can play it on my viola, simply by adding a bit more weight to the bow for that one beat, which is the effect I want. But it's not really a dynamic change... or at least it's like p to "p + a microscopic amount" and back to p.

I think I'll use the Lv indication then.

Quickly, do you happen to know of a marking that assures "off the string"?
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by N Grossingink » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:49 pm

Michel R E wrote:Quickly, do you happen to know of a marking that assures "off the string"?
How about a breath mark (comma) before the note?
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by oldmkvi » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:59 pm

I'd write an accent with "poco".

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Michel R E
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by Michel R E » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:29 pm

well, for the "appuyé" effect, I think I'll just speak to the conductor, then cheat and look at how the musicians marked it in their parts.
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by motet » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:54 pm

Since the dynamic is pp, perhaps the accent wouldn't be over-played. You could add (poco) or something like that. I would steer clear of tenuto or other ambiguous notation.

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Michel R E
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Re: O/T adding an emphasis to a tremolo (what marking)

Post by Michel R E » Wed Sep 11, 2019 5:01 pm

Thanks Motet.
That's a good suggestion, and a good point about the dynamic.
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