More intelligent chord analysis possible?

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kevinmathie
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:16 pm
Finale Version: Finale 27
Operating System: Mac

Post by kevinmathie » Thu May 08, 2014 3:55 pm

Hi all,

I'm on Finale 2014 right now, but this has been a problem for me for a long time. I'm wondering if it's possible to get more intelligent enharmonic spellings. I arrange and write a lot of musical theater and jazz, which, of course, goes in and out of keys without changing the key signature. But, the chords I use, are all pretty normal chords. Yes, I use a lot of jazz extensions (i.e., 11 chords, flat-9 chords, etc), but nothing is atonal or way out there.

Yet, the attached pic is a very common occurrence. The key signature is in G major, but I'm writing a simple B-flat minor chord, and the default is completely un-sight-readable by most musicians. So, I have to manually go back and dictate the enharmonic notes so that it looks like a B-flat minor chord.

Right now, I'm on "Use Spelling Tables" in the Enharmonic spellings options, but it usually doesn't matter what setting I'm on, I get garbled chords when I input them via Speedy Note Entry (my favored input method). Yes, "favor flats" or "favor sharps" does work better than Default spellings or Spelling Tables, but that also slows me down, because I then have keep going back and forth between favoring sharps or flats depending on which chord I'm going to, which could mean several switches per song.

So, I guess my question is, is there a spelling table available, or something, that is more intelligent about the way it reads the notes I'm inputting? Instead of Finale simply reading the individual notes, and choosing what enharmonic notes to give me based on some random table, is there a spelling table available that would allow Finale to see that, "Oh! He's playing a B-flat minor chord right now. I'll give him the notes Bb, Db and F, regardless of what the key signature is"?

I hope so, because this is one thing about Finale that really, really, really slows me down when it comes to inputting notes.

Thanks!
Kevin
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Mac Mini (M2 Pro), Mac OSX Ventura (13.2.1), Finale 27.3


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Peter Thomsen
Posts: 6601
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 6:47 pm
Finale Version: Finale v27.4
Operating System: Mac

Post by Peter Thomsen » Thu May 08, 2014 5:12 pm

I seriously doubt that is possible to write software, that can respell notes “intelligently”.
It is just too complicated.

My guess is that you have to use the “wetware” between your ears.

An idea:
First input all the notes.
Some of the notes will be spelled incorrectly, but don’t worry!

Next, select a region where the music stays in the same key for a while.
Choose a spelling table that is suitable for that particular key, and then use
Utilities menu > Respell Notes
or
MIDI/Audio menu > Retranscribe

Next, select the next region where the music stays in the same key for a while (another key, probably).
Choose a spelling table suitable for that particular key, and then use
Utilities menu > Respell Notes
or
MIDI/Audio menu > Retranscribe

&c.

&c.
Mac OS X 12.6.9 (Monterey), Finale user since 1996

kevinmathie
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:16 pm
Finale Version: Finale 27
Operating System: Mac

Post by kevinmathie » Thu May 08, 2014 7:05 pm

Ah! That could be a workable solution. Just something that's faster than stopping all the time and going back to manually change the notes.

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll try them. :)
Mac Mini (M2 Pro), Mac OSX Ventura (13.2.1), Finale 27.3

kevinmathie
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:16 pm
Finale Version: Finale 27
Operating System: Mac

Post by kevinmathie » Thu May 08, 2014 11:40 pm

By the way, I guess I'm missing why analyzing chords in real time would be such a difficult thing for Finale to do. Apple's Logic Pro does it in real time, and does it quite accurately. If you look in Logic's transport area, whenever you play any group of notes, Logic will do its best to analyze, in real time, what chord you're playing. Cluster chords gives Logic an aneurism, but anything remotely traditional is pretty accurate. You can throw altered chord extensions and non-root-position chords at it, and it does great.

I mean, true, I may be thinking in my head, "I need a C# major chord here" and it'll tell me it's a D-flat, but I think that would be acceptable for Finale to do. If Finale could just say "I recognize this as a specific chord" then if it would let me hit the number 9 to change the entire chord enharmonically (i.e., changing it from a D-flat major to C# major), in one click, it would be SO much easier than the current situation, where I have to change each individual note in the chord that's wrong, or deal with various spelling tables.

Anyway, that's my rant for today. In the meantime, I'll try your suggestions. :)

Thanks!
Kevin
Mac Mini (M2 Pro), Mac OSX Ventura (13.2.1), Finale 27.3

heterophonic
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:21 pm
Finale Version: 25
Operating System: Windows

Post by heterophonic » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:19 pm

You can also enter your notes, select a region and using the Key Signature Tool, change the key, but check the "hide key signature and show all accidentals" option, and make sure you leave the notes where they are enharmonically. That can allow you to respell a region as if it's "in a key"

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