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Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

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Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby caild » Thu Nov 03, 2016 7:45 am

I am creating an extracetd part for a singer in which descant or cue parts (and even the whole ensemble) occasionally makes a brief appearances. Mostly the part is just one staff of the extracted voice though. I went through and edited out the parts I didn't need by using the Staff Tool and Force Hide Staff Collapse. This allows me to cut out only certain parts at a time. The problem is, when the staff is ONLY the soprano part and there are many measures empty, it won't let me make multimeasure rests. How can I achieve my goal while having multimeasure rests?


Thank you
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby Peter Thomsen » Thu Nov 03, 2016 2:10 pm

Welcome to the forum!

If I understand you correctly, you are using a staff style to “Force Hide Staff and Collapse”, right?
And you are unable to create a multimeasure rest where there is a staff hidden with “Force Hide Staff and Collapse”, right?

I am sorry, but I am unable to duplicate your problem.
For me, the multimeasure rest is created without any difficulties.

I suspect that there is something else going on, preventing the multimeasure rest.

Without seeing an actual Finale document we can only guess.

I suggest that you attach a (small) Finale sample document here.

This forum does not accept attachments with the Finale file name extension.

Before you can attach a Finale document in this forum, you must compress it, e. g. as a .zip file.
And the file size must not be more than max. 100 KB.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby caild » Thu Nov 03, 2016 3:57 pm

How can I compress a .zip file for posting in this forum?
Do I go to Export and export the file as MusicXML?

Thank you so much for your quick response! You have no idea how much it means to me.

Christian Cail
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby miker » Thu Nov 03, 2016 4:16 pm

You would need to use something like WinZip (unless MS has added this function to the OS.)
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby caild » Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:28 pm

Hopefully this works. I am sending a WinZip file attached below.
Thank you again fellows!

Cail
Attachments
SAMPLE MEZZO.zip
(94.54 KiB) Downloaded 31 times
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby caild » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:39 pm

I am also having difficulty keeping rehearsal marks for the bottom voices when I collapse the top voice (as the top voice would be unnecessary in the single part). What is the best way to make a score for a single part (like an extracted part) but include descant and cue parts in other adjacent staves? That is truly the root of all my difficulty.


Thank you


**Edit** The problem with the rehearsal mark went away
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby Peter Thomsen » Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:05 pm

Christian,

Take a look at the attached document.
Is this what you need?
Attachments
SAMPLE MEZZO fixed.musx.zip
(94.12 KiB) Downloaded 32 times
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby maennis1112 » Sun May 06, 2018 9:31 pm

Hello everyone!

I know this thread is old, but I'm having the exact same problem. Your example file is exactly what I need, but I'm unable to replicate it. The setting seems to be the same. Is there something I've forgotten? I'm in a linked part (flute) where I have added two more staves for references for the electronics. In the TACET section, I have collapsed the electronics and am left with a bunch of truly empty (default empty) measures that I'd like to multi-measure-rest. Not working. It obviously works when I get rid of the additional two staves in the part definition. But I need those staves (at times ;) ).

I'm running a brand-new Finale 25 on Mac OS X 10.13. Any help would greatly be appreciated! Thanks so much in advance!
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby Peter Thomsen » Mon May 07, 2018 5:14 am

maennis1112 wrote:… Your example file is exactly what I need, but I'm unable to replicate it. The setting seems to be the same. Is there something I've forgotten? I'm in a linked part (flute) where I have added two more staves for references for the electronics. In the TACET section, I have collapsed the electronics and am left with a bunch of truly empty (default empty) measures that I'd like to multi-measure-rest. Not working. It obviously works when I get rid of the additional two staves in the part definition …

Since I am unable to duplicate your problem, I suggest that you attach a Finale sample document showing the problem.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby motet » Mon May 07, 2018 4:05 pm

If you've "collapsed" the staves with a staff style, you might try using "hide empty staves" from the staff tool instead.

After doing this, you need to create the multimeasure rest explicitly--it won't happen automatically.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby maennis1112 » Thu May 10, 2018 3:41 pm

Hello you two,

thanks so much for your answer,and sorry for my late reply, I'm new to this forum and was expecting an e-mail in case anyone replies.

@ motet: Hide empty staves is not an option since my staves are not really empty; their content is just irrelevant for the player since they don't need to be playing anyway.

@ Peter Thomsen: I've attached a sample; the text expressions with time indications are configured as non-breaking multi-measure rests; but anyway the problem was already there before I even inserted that category. So the idea is to have the tape staves hidden (in the sample it says piano) and then make multi-measure rests in the part of the flute. Hope you can help me out on this.

Thanks a bunch everybody!
Attachments
score_example_multimeasure_test.zip
(110.19 KiB) Downloaded 1 time
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby maennis1112 » Thu May 10, 2018 4:04 pm

Sorry I just realized I was being sloppy with adapting the sample file (the original one was too big to attach, even partly). Here's it again (in the earlier file I forgot to change the part defintion. The section I'm unable to put multi-measure rests is between D and F.

Sorry for the confusion and thanks again in advance for your help.
Attachments
score_example_multimeasure_test.zip
updated file sample
(116.16 KiB) Downloaded 6 times
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby Peter Thomsen » Thu May 10, 2018 7:06 pm

maennis1112,

Take a look at the attached document.

Is this what you need?

score_example_multimeasure_fixed.musx
(115.64 KiB) Downloaded 4 times


In the Flute part there are multimeasure rests between D and F.

What I did:
Document menu > Document Options > Multimeasure Rests > De-select “Update Automatically”

Explanation: “Update Automatically” breaks a multimeasure rest where there are non-empty measures.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby zuill » Thu May 10, 2018 7:26 pm

I'm guessing this might be broken in Windows. I can break your MM rests, but then I cannot recreate them. MakeMusic might need to have this reported. I'm guessing it works on Mac only.

Zuill

P.S.: I even tested this in 2014.5 with the same results. Definitely not something Windows can do.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby maennis1112 » Thu May 10, 2018 7:49 pm

Dear Peter, dear zuill,

thanks for your quick reply. @ Peter: This is exactly what I need, but unfortunately I can't recreate this in my file, even with update automatically deselected. More than that, I'm having the same troubles recreating the multimeasure rests in your document as zuill is reporting: once I've broken them, I can't even create them again. (So this doesn't seem to be a Windows-specific problem). Do you happen to have another idea what the problem might be? I realized that in your document the additional two staves were also hidden/collapsed in the score; if that's what makes the difference, this is not what I need, since I need them to show in the score ALWAYS, but only sometimes in the part. Would be amazing if you had another hint for this.

Thanks a lot!
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby motet » Thu May 10, 2018 8:02 pm

I made a test file with two staves. I filled in some notes in both staves, collapsed one of the staves, and Finale was able to create multimeasure rests properly. So it works in general.

There is something broken about this file. Some measures have "break a multimeasure rest" or "begin a new staff system" set, but even clearing those doesn't fix things. I tried clearing various staff styles and unhiding barlines and that helped some, but not everywhere.

Can you just leave the tape out of the flute part? I'm a little unclear why you're doing this.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby maennis1112 » Thu May 10, 2018 8:27 pm

Hey motet,

thanks for your reply. I did the same thing and you're right, it works. Yes, there is something weird about the file, I also have one big bug in the sax part (that I cut out); although the file I uploaded is a new file where I just c&p'd some bars.

I need the tape part for coordination since the players asked me for it. Obviously it would be way easier without... I'll try what you said about the begin a new staff system etc. and the other ideas, let's see where I can get with this.

Thanks!
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby Peter Thomsen » Thu May 10, 2018 9:32 pm

maennis1112 wrote:… @ Peter: This is exactly what I need, but unfortunately I can't recreate this in my file, even with update automatically deselected …

I did this to fix the Flute part:

1) Switch to Scroll View.

2) Select the Piano in the region between D and F.

3) Cut out (= Command-X) the music in the selected region (this step will place the music in the Finale Clipboard).

4) Switch to Page View.

5) Select the Flute in the region between D and F - and create multimeasure rests.

6) Switch to Scroll View.

7) Select the Piano in the region between D and F.

8) Paste (= Command-V) the music from the Clipboard into the selected region.

As a final step I had to apply (again) the staff style Force Hide Staff to the Piano.

Step 8) did not break the multimeasure rests because “Update Automatically” was de-selected.
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Re: Multimeasure rests and descant/cue parts

Postby zuill » Thu May 10, 2018 10:54 pm

Okay. I knew there had to be some trickery as Mac had the same problem as Win.

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