fingering

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musicus
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Post by musicus » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:41 pm

test.mus.zip
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On the attached file, the last quarter of the measure has B -B-C sharp E in the R hand. I put a "1" over the first B, but I can't seem to drag it a bit higher. It snaps back, crowding the note. How do I fix this?


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miker
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Post by miker » Sat Nov 19, 2016 12:13 am

I don't know what to tell you. It worked fine for me. I double-clicked on the articulation, grabbed the handle, and moved it. No problem.
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John Ruggero
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Post by John Ruggero » Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:15 pm

This is quite a late reply, Musicus, but maybe it will help you or someone else, and it certainly helps me because I am practicing using this site for the first time in a very long time!

The problem is that you are attaching the number 1 (articulation) to the layer 1 16th-rest rather than the layer 2 note B. Finale has trouble with articulations attached to rests and they jump around. It is not clear to me why you have the long melody notes in layer 2 and the faster notes in layer 1, but if this is what you really want, delete the 1 and input it again while in layer 2. You might also turn off "avoid staff lines" and "center horizontally" in the articulation designer for your finger numbers if you want maximum flexibility in positioning them. Double click on the handle of each finger number to get to the articulation designer for that number.
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Post by NickG » Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:49 pm

OT in a way.
Why dosen't Finale have "0" fingering for violin, open string. I create one in Articulations but when I create a new document, I have to re-create it.
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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:57 pm

NickG wrote:OT in a way.
Why dosen't Finale have "0" fingering for violin, open string. I create one in Articulations but when I create a new document, I have to re-create it.
Welcome to the forum!

Add the "0" articulation to the template you use for new documents.
In that way all your new documents will have the "0" articulation.
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Post by NickG » Wed Dec 28, 2016 11:41 pm

Peter Thomsen wrote:Add the "0" articulation to the template you use for new documents.
In that way all your new documents will have the "0" articulation.
The trouble with templates is that they keep the instrumentation. If save a template for solo violin, than open it to score and orchestration, I have to enter all the instruments one by one. If the template gave you the option to keep or discard the instrumentation, that would be good. If you discard, then, when opening the template, you would get the same dialog screens as when creating a new document.
Last edited by NickG on Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by miker » Wed Dec 28, 2016 11:54 pm

Seems they don't know a lot of things...
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motet
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Post by motet » Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:54 am

I believe 0 is also commonly used in cello writing to indicate the thumb when playing way up on the fingerboard.

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David Ward
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Post by David Ward » Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:56 am

motet wrote:I believe 0 is also commonly used in cello writing to indicate the thumb when playing way up on the fingerboard.
I have used + to indicate the thumb on cello (when I wanted to specify the fingering in a cadenza).
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Post by NickG » Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:58 pm

Peter Thomsen wrote:Add the "0" articulation to the template you use for new documents.
In that way all your new documents will have the "0" articulation.
The trouble with templates is that they keep the instrumentation. If save a template for solo violin, than open it to score and orchestration, I have to enter all the instruments one by one. If the template gave you the option to keep or discard the instrumentation, that would be good. If you discard, then, when opening the template, you would get the same dialog screens as when creating a new document.
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Post by miker » Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:47 pm

You could save the O in a library of its own, and load it in docs where needed.
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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:55 pm

NickG wrote:… The trouble with templates is that they keep the instrumentation. If I save a template for solo violin, then open it to score and orchestration, I have to enter all the instruments one by one. If the template gave you the option to keep or discard the instrumentation, that would be good. If you discard, then, when opening the template, you would get the same dialog screens as when creating a new document.
I am confused.
It sounds like you are talking about “opening template” and “create new document” as if they were two different things ?!?

All new documents are created from a template.
There are several ways to create a new document.
They all have their own template(s).

1) File menu > New > Document With Setup Wizard…
The templates for the wizard are located in the folder Document Styles.

2) File menu > New > Default Document
You can choose which document Finale should use as template for a new (default) document:
Finale menu > Preferences > New > Default Document
If you have not chosen a template for new default documents, Finale will use Maestro Font Default.
Look in the folder Default Files.

3) Document From Template…
The templates (for the command “Document From Template”) are located in the folder Templates.

4) File menu > New > Document Without Libraries
This particular template is hardwired in the Finale program.
You can not edit it.
But you can create a new document from the “Document Without Libraries”, edit that new document, and use the new document as a template.

What, exactly, do you mean by your words “create new document” ?
Please explain.
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Post by NickG » Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:32 pm

Peter Thomsen wrote:I am confused.
It sounds like you are talking about “opening template” and “create new document” as if they were two different things ?!?

All new documents are created from a template.
There are several ways to create a new document.
They all have their own template(s).

1) File menu > New > Document With Setup Wizard…
The templates for the wizard are located in the folder Document Styles.

2) File menu > New > Default Document
You can choose which document Finale should use as template for a new (default) document:
Finale menu > Preferences > New > Default Document
If you have not chosen a template for new default documents, Finale will use Maestro Font Default.
Look in the folder Default Files.

3) Document From Template…
The templates (for the command “Document From Template”) are located in the folder Templates.

4) File menu > New > Document Without Libraries
This particular template is hardwired in the Finale program.
You can not edit it.
But you can create a new document from the “Document Without Libraries”, edit that new document, and use the new document as a template.

What, exactly, do you mean by your words “create new document” ?
Please explain.
When you create a new document using "Set Up Wizard", you get to select Ensemble, Doc Style, Page Size etc...
When you open a template, those options are not available. So if make changes in articulations as discussed, then save the document as a template as you suggest, the next time I want to use the articulations I created and open the template, the only options I have when opening the template are:
New Title, New Meter and Key etc... I don't get to select Ensemble, Doc Style, Page Size etc...
What if I was doing an orchestral score and wanted to use the articulations I created and the template I created the articulations in were for solo violin. I would have to go to Score Manager and add all the orchestral instruments. Very time consuming.
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miker
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Post by miker » Thu Dec 29, 2016 5:45 pm

Of course you don't get all the selections when you open a template. That's because it's a template, and those decisions have already been made!

As I said, save your custom articulations as a library, and just add them in whenever you want or need them.
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motet
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Post by motet » Thu Dec 29, 2016 5:54 pm

Do you have a technique for saving just the custom articulations? If you save everything, including the standard ones, I've found you can get duplicates when you then load it into another file.

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Post by zuill » Thu Dec 29, 2016 6:07 pm

I delete all but the custom one(s). Then I save the Library. Remember that metatools don't get saved in a Library. Copying from one document to another is another way to get a custom item (articulation, expression, smart shape )into another file. That is the down-and-dirty approach.

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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Thu Dec 29, 2016 6:53 pm

NickG wrote:… When you create a new document using "Set Up Wizard", you get to select Ensemble, Doc Style, Page Size etc...
When you open a template, those options are not available. So if make changes in articulations as discussed, then save the document as a template as you suggest, the next time I want to use the articulations I created and open the template, the only options I have when opening the template are:
New Title, New Meter and Key etc... I don't get to select Ensemble, Doc Style, Page Size etc...
What if I was doing an orchestral score and wanted to use the articulations I created and the template I created the articulations in were for solo violin. I would have to go to Score Manager and add all the orchestral instruments. Very time consuming.
Now I understand.
Your words “create new document” mean my option 1) Document With Setup Wizard.

The wizard uses the templates located in the folder Document Styles.
I suggest that you move your custom template to the folder Document Styles (or modify an existing template in the folder Document Styles).
Then your custom template will be available in the wizard.

NB:
There are two separate Finale folder hierarchies, with the same folder names (including the folder name Document Styles).

One resides in your user account’s (possibly hidden) Library folder.
This is the Document Styles folder the wizard uses.
This is where you should have your custom template.

Another one resides in the root level Library folder.
The root level Library folder is never hidden.
This folder hierarchy serves as Finale’s “backup” of its “default” folders.
If a folder (or file) is missing from your user account’s Finale folder hierarchy, Finale will create a new copy from the “backup”.

I hope that this is clear?
If not, ask again.
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miker
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Post by miker » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:09 pm

I work backwards from Zuill, but to the same end. I open a document without libraries, create my customs, and save that.
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Post by NickG » Fri Dec 30, 2016 12:47 am

Thanks Peter, that was very helpful.
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Post by NickG » Fri Dec 30, 2016 2:01 pm

Peter Thomson:
I tried your suggestion about moving my file with the articulation changes to the Document Styles folder. Now, as you said it shows up in my Set Up Wizard. I was looking for this solution for a very long time. I asked MM at one point if they could make the changes made in articulations global instead of document specific. They said that because of Finale's architecture, they couldn't do it. Changes made to articulations had to be document specific. Their solution was to save the articulation changes to a library, then load them or, create a template(which you know I didn't want to do for the reasons we discussed). Your solution works. In a sense, this made articulation changes global. I don't have to open a template and I don't have load a librarry. I'll notify MM about your solution.
Thanks very much.
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Post by HaraldS » Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:23 pm

NickG wrote:I asked MM at one point if they could make the changes made in articulations global instead of document specific. They said that because of Finale's architecture, they couldn't do it. [...] Their solution was [...]
If you're referring to https://makemusic.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/ ... in-Finale- : that wasn't Make Music answering you, that was me.

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Post by NickG » Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:03 pm

HaraldS wrote:
NickG wrote:I asked MM at one point if they could make the changes made in articulations global instead of document specific. They said that because of Finale's architecture, they couldn't do it. [...] Their solution was [...]
If you're referring to https://makemusic.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/ ... in-Finale- : that wasn't Make Music answering you, that was me.

Harald
I see. Sorry about the mix up. No doubt the architecture part is true, but the solution Peter gave me seems to make the changes in articulations global(in a way). I'm a bit puzzled that MM couldn't be a bit more helpful.
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Post by Luka Puka » Wed Jan 04, 2017 3:20 am

I know this is solved, but I think there could've been a simpler answer...?
Couldn't you just have highlighted the fingering notation and then pressed the up arrow key? Or does that still make it snap back to the note? I've always used the arrow keys to make adjustments to expressions and articulations because it's too frustrating with the mouse.

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Post by musicus » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:38 pm

Sorry for this late reply, and thanks for your posted reply to my vexation. The long melody lines in layer 2 represent the vocal melody line in a piano transcription of "In Paradisum." The full context is not visible here for obvious reasons, but the first page of the transcription can be previewed here: http://scarlatt9.wixsite.com/transcript ... -paradisum
John Ruggero wrote:This is quite a late reply, Musicus, but maybe it will help you or someone else, and it certainly helps me because I am practicing using this site for the first time in a very long time!

The problem is that you are attaching the number 1 (articulation) to the layer 1 16th-rest rather than the layer 2 note B. Finale has trouble with articulations attached to rests and they jump around. It is not clear to me why you have the long melody notes in layer 2 and the faster notes in layer 1, but if this is what you really want, delete the 1 and input it again while in layer 2. You might also turn off "avoid staff lines" and "center horizontally" in the articulation designer for your finger numbers if you want maximum flexibility in positioning them. Double click on the handle of each finger number to get to the articulation designer for that number.

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Post by Komponist » Thu May 10, 2018 12:44 am

Hello, everyone. I'm new to the forum, although I've been scouring your old conversations for a long time. I didn't know where you went until today when I got a reply from MM about the issues I've been having with piano fingering - which brought me here and is the substance of my question. I've been trying to figure out how to keep all the treble clef fingering above the staff and all the bass clef fingering below the staff, as per Elaine Gould's music notation guide, "Behind Bars." None of the responses that I've gotten from MM actually do what they say those solutions will do. I've also searched the Beginners and General Finale Help for answers before posting this. So, I'm turning to the forum for some help. Anyone figured this out?

P.S. I don't know if this the proper place for the question, but this is my first time, and you're all talking about the subject. If there's another forum or method for such posts, let me know, and I'll get it right the next time.

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