cross staff lyrics (i.e. middle c position piano music)

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Sunshinenotes
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Post by Sunshinenotes » Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:49 am

Hello,

I've asked this before -- and had and answer that worked-- but it was on the old forum and I cannot find it. I'm doing quite a bit of arranging for five finger piano in middle C position. That means lyrics that coordinate with a melody that shifts between treble and bass clef. I don't want to have to put quarter rests into the treble when it should be dotted half, just to make the lyrics match up. (they either want to glom to the treble or bass clef or a rest in the clef that they are attached to)

I remember that the best way to do this was to enter the rhythm of the lyrics in a separate layer--then hide that layer from playback and more importantly from printing. I cannot figure out how to hide the layer and retain the lyrics..... does anyone remember?


Debbie Fitts
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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Thu Sep 20, 2018 4:40 am

What I would do:

Enter all the notes in one staff (do not worry about the many ledger lines).

Attach the lyrics to the notes.

In the other staff, hide the Default Whole Rests in the empty measures (use the Staff Tool).

Use the plug-in to create Cross Staff Notation so that the “ledger line notes” display in the other staff.
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miker
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Post by miker » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:53 pm

I'm confused. If you have cross staff notes, won't the stems collide with the lyrics? Can you post a picture of what it looks like?
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zuill
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Post by zuill » Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:41 pm

I don't think the question is about cross-staff notes, but about music for easy piano using middle C position where the melody goes back and forth between the staves. So, instructions about using the cross staff feature in Finale is not what is needed. It is more about how to get the lyrics to show between the staves when the notes vacillate between the staves.

I do this a couple of different ways. It's easiest to attach each lyric to its own staff, then change the baseline for just the lower staff to be above the staff, instead of below. Align the lower staff lyric baseline with the upper staff lyric baseline.

Zuill
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zuill
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Post by zuill » Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:52 pm

I hope my posted sample file shows what is needed.

In my demo, I only changed the lower staff lyric position for the second system, so I could show before and after. For that I used the 3rd triangle to drag the lyrics up. For a real document, I would use the 2nd triangle so that the lower staff baseline would be the same throughout the document. If a demo of that is needed, I could provide one.

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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:16 pm

Sunshinenotes wrote:… I don't want to have to put quarter rests into the treble when it should be dotted half, just to make the lyrics match up …
It sounds like Debbie Fitts needs a layout without rests.

See the attached example.
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zuill
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Post by zuill » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:41 pm

I understood about the rests, but didn't address that, as the main concern was the way to enter lyrics. The method I used allows one to not have to attach lyrics to a hidden layer all on one staff, as the work involved is time consuming, more complicated, and unnecessary.

I should have addressed the lack of rests in the score. Thanks for posting the revised sample. By the way, just unselecting default rests and normal rests in staff attributes (for both staves) should be all that is necessary. This would save manually hiding rests one by one.

I've revised my file to demonstrate the Staff Attributes approach to hiding normal rests.

Zuill
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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:30 pm

And here is the other way to do it, with cross staff notes.
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Sunshinenotes
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Post by Sunshinenotes » Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:57 am

Thank you all. I think the two-lyric, adjusting the baseline to accommodate works the easiest. I've also just finished a short piece by attaching lyrics to a hidden layer (kind of awkward but it works well) I wasn't looking to eliminate rests entirely (although in some instances that would be a good option) -- but to attach lyrics to a measure that had a quarter note on beat one in treble, then three quarter notes on beats 2,3 and 4 in bass clef. By attaching to the treble only I had to leave three single count rests on beats 2,3,& 4 rather than a quarter and half which would be standard notation. (png images attached here of what I didn't want and what I finally figured out how to get!)

I wonder if Finale can include some kind of flip/switch (like the L in speedy switching stem directions) to attach a lyric to the note in a treble or bass piano part -- it seems like this would be a pretty common problem. There are millions of middle C piano pieces out there!

Thank you again!
Sunshine Notes AKA Debbie Fitts
"I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now"

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