Using a forward repeat at bar 1

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Hector Pascal
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Post by Hector Pascal » Mon Sep 30, 2019 6:58 am

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Question:
I know that a forward-repeat barline is not usually required at the opening bar of a piece, but in this case, would you agree that one is needed?

With thanks for any thoughts,
Hector.


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HaraldS
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Post by HaraldS » Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:00 am

Hector Pascal wrote:
Mon Sep 30, 2019 6:58 am
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Question:
I know that a forward-repeat barline is not usually required at the opening bar of a piece, but in this case, would you agree that one is needed?
I would not agree. You can omit the first repeat. But the last (=closing) repeat doesn't make clear where to jump to, as it has no corresponding forward repeat. If you want the player to jump to bar 1, a Da Capo would be needed.
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johnmouse
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Post by johnmouse » Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:19 am

I agree with Harold. The initial repeat is not needed, but the second one should be more clearly defined.

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Hector Pascal
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Post by Hector Pascal » Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:57 pm

Many thanks for your thoughts on this. My intention is to have the following order of bars:

Bars: 1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3


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I didn't use a da capo because I thought everyone would know to return to the only forward-facing repeat (bar1).

As there is room for doubt (as evidenced in this thread!), I am now thinking about writing out the music more fully...

HP.

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johnmouse
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Post by johnmouse » Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:36 am

You'll have to use an alternate way of repeating. After playing bar 3, there is nowhere to repeat back to since the repeat at bar 2 is clearly for the first two bars only.

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HaraldS
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Post by HaraldS » Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:51 am

Hector Pascal wrote:
Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:57 pm
My intention is to have the following order of bars:
Bars: 1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3
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Write "Da capo senza repetitione". You can also translate the "senza repetitione" to "without repeats" or any language you like. The "Da capo" is a technical term in music and thus should not be translated.

You can also write "Da capo al Fine" and add a "Fine" in the last bar to stress the fact that the end is really in bar 3. But it's also fine without a "Fine" ;).
Hector Pascal wrote:
Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:57 pm
I didn't use a da capo because I thought everyone would know to return to the only forward-facing repeat (bar1).
The usual execution of a backward repeat is to jump to the last forward repeat. So there has to be a forward repeat in normal case. Only if the forward repeat is at the start of the piece, it can be omitted. That's why your bar 3 would need a forward repeat.
Hector Pascal wrote:
Tue Oct 01, 2019 11:57 pm
As there is room for doubt (as evidenced in this thread!), I am now thinking about writing out the music more fully...
If the piece consists of really only 3 written bars, that's definitely the best way.

As far as I'm concerned, I wouldn't see a doubt in the interpretation of repeats in this thread. I would consider your example above as an error. Not a big thing, as the last back repeat can easily be replaced by a "Da capo", but these are exactly these kinds of errors which take more rehearsal time than necessary.
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N Grossingink
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Post by N Grossingink » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:12 am

I would write out the passage entirely with no repeats, DSs, etc. It's only 8 bars total.
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