add cues staves in a extracted percussion part

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cms57
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Post by cms57 » Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:44 am

Hello! When I extract the parts from a score and start working on them, it is very useful to insert bars (one or more) with the musical part of some other musical instrument that therefore serves as a guide,
in Italian they are called "guide" and I don't know if the exact translation is "cue".
I have no problems when I do this with the other parts but when I work with the percussion parts
if I use copy / paste they result in very different musical lines and with different note heads depending on the position!
If I change the instrument for several measures (it doesn't work for one measure only), I can insert the musical parts of the other instruments (which I then insert in Layer 2 and reduce by 75%) but it doesn't always work
and moreover links are created between the " cue "parts about bass clef and violin.
So my question is: to get "cue / guide" bars in a percussion part what is the right procedure?
Can the add cue notes plug-in work when the part has already been extracted from the score?
Thanks for your help!
Corrado


Anders Hedelin
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Post by Anders Hedelin » Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:49 pm

I don't know if this is what you are looking for, but my method is to duplicate the entire score when it's as good as ready, to a parts score where the linked parts can be edited. So you don't have to extract any parts at all. (If you do, they will have no linking to the score whatsoever.)

To be more specific, if you want a separate staff for cues in a percussion part (or percussion score, with all the percussion instruments), you'll have to create that in the score already (with Score Manager), having it show where needed only. Without extracting parts of course.

Others have clever methods of keeping everything in the same document: score, linked parts and cues. There was a thread here recently discussing that in some detail if you want to check:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=19579
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motet
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Post by motet » Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:48 pm

The plug-in won't work between the score and an extracted part; that's one of many reasons not to extract. But you could use the plug-in in your score, then copy those measures from score to extracted part. The plug-in uses layer 4, not layer 2.

As you've discovered, a percussion staff can't display normal notes. So use Change instrument to "Blank staff" first for those measures where you want to put cues. It should work for a single measure, though probably not for a partial measure. I'm not sure what you mean by "links are created between the cue parts about bass clef and violin"--can you elaborate? And I'm not sure why "it doesn't always work." I encourage you to use the plug-in in the score and then copy it into your extracted part--the plug-in does several things for you automatically. As Anders says, you can make a separate copy of the score to do this if you want.

cms57
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Post by cms57 » Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:18 am

Hello! Thanks "Anders" and thanks "motet"!
This is my first time using this forum and it is very nice and encouraging to have relevant and helpful answers!
I seem to have understood that fundamentally my way of extracting the parts and then working on them is not the most orthodox one ... But I have always done this because having the parts of every single instrument you can better evaluate the details and sometimes you discover forgetfulness and errors.
Surely making a copy of the score, inserting the cues and then copying them is perhaps the quickest and most effective way.
Actually I was proud of my method where I also use two Finale scripts that I made to transform the copy paste into cues ...
I'll try to learn the correct way!
Regarding the cues in the percussion parts I think that "motet"'s advice "So use Change instrument to" Blank staff "" solves the problem I mentioned "links are created between the cue parts about bass clef and violin" because if I change instrument and then change key, the key changes automatically even in cues made previously.
Anyway thanks again to both of you and "Buona Musica"!
Corrado

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ebiggs1
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Post by ebiggs1 » Fri Dec 04, 2020 5:33 pm

Recently I have found if you want certain things a certain way it is best if not easier to have a "regular, normal" score. A separate score for parts and another separate score for sound. This renders the best of that specific reason for being I can think of. The problem here is you need to be aware if you change the "regular" score to do so in the others.
I never extract parts any longer.
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cms57
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Post by cms57 » Sat Dec 05, 2020 7:32 am

Hello "ebiggs1", thanks for your message.
Yes, I'm using a score for playback too: it works much better especially for percussion!
You wrote "I never extract parts any longer": how do you work on the single parts if you don't extract them?
Thanks!
Corrado

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Peter Thomsen
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Post by Peter Thomsen » Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:15 pm

cms57 wrote:
Sat Dec 05, 2020 7:32 am
… You wrote "I never extract parts any longer": how do you work on the single parts if you don't extract them? …
It sounds like you are not familiar with linked parts?

Document menu > Edit Part > …

Finale has had linked parts since Finale 2007.
Mac OS X 12.6.9 (Monterey), Finale user since 1996

Anders Hedelin
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Post by Anders Hedelin » Sat Dec 05, 2020 2:59 pm

You mention 'percussion parts'. It sounds as if it were for more than one player, but if it's for just one, I think the advice given already might be sufficient. If it's for more than one player, I might be able to give you one method how to do that.
Last edited by Anders Hedelin on Sat Dec 05, 2020 3:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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ebiggs1
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Post by ebiggs1 » Sat Dec 05, 2020 3:08 pm

how do you work on the single parts if you don't extract them?
I use "Linked Parts" like Peter Thomsen mentioned. WHen you are in your score, press Ctrl + Alt + . (period key). That will bring up your first part. Press them again and your next part comes up and so on............... If you want back to the score press Ctrl + Alt + /.
This is for Windows so if you're using a Mac you will need to get the correct keystrokes.
BTW, if you want to progress backwards, the last part first, press, Ctrl + Alt + , (comma).

The beauty of this is a change in the score is updated in each part automatically. If you extract parts, you create a completely new file. It is unrelated to your score. In Linked Parts, there is a menu where you can "un-link" (not affected by changes in the score). However, you can also "re-link" it. Plus, you can "show" or "hide" things, too.
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ebiggs1
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Post by ebiggs1 » Sat Dec 05, 2020 3:13 pm

I'm using a score for playback too: it works much better especially for percussion!

Percussion is where a separate sound file helps the most. Percussion is the worst of the sounds in Finale, IMHO, of course. I go so far as to put as many percussion instruments on a single staff as I can. It certainly takes to most effort to get a somewhat acceptable sound, IMHO, again.
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motet
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Post by motet » Sat Dec 05, 2020 4:06 pm

You can select the part to edit from the Document menu.

cms57
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Post by cms57 » Sun Dec 06, 2020 2:12 pm

Thanks again everyone!
I feel a bit embarrassed because I too have been using Finale for many years...
but I almost always use the same methods I learned from the beginning or with practice (self-taught)
and until now no one has helped me so clearly and directly.
From the next job I will treasure your advice!
Ciao!
Corrado

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