courtesy naturals

General notation questions, including advanced notation, formatting, etc., go here.

Moderators: Peter Thomsen, miker

Post Reply
musicus
Posts: 833
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 11:12 pm
Finale Version: Finale v26
Operating System: Mac

Post by musicus » Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:56 pm

On Finale 2011 I could tap on a note (Speedy) and press "8" do give it
a courtesy natural. How do I do it with v26?


mknoll
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 2:08 pm
Finale Version: 2014, 2014.5, 25
Operating System: Mac

Post by mknoll » Sun Dec 13, 2020 12:07 am

This has been "*" (asterisk, i.e., shift-8) as long as I can remember, and I've been a Finale user for a very long time!

musicus
Posts: 833
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 11:12 pm
Finale Version: Finale v26
Operating System: Mac

Post by musicus » Sun Dec 13, 2020 12:17 am

This is what happens when I've been minus Finale for a month. You're absolutely right. Thanks for the solution!
mknoll wrote:
Sun Dec 13, 2020 12:07 am
This has been "*" (asterisk, i.e., shift-8) as long as I can remember, and I've been a Finale user for a very long time!

User avatar
David Ward
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:48 pm
Finale Version: F 25.5 & 26.3
Operating System: Mac

Post by David Ward » Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:32 pm

Actually, in most cases keying ‘A’ may be a safer option than ‘*’ which can hide or show a necessary accidental as well as a cautionary, while ‘A’ will show or hide a cautionary, but won't have any effect on a necessary one.
Finale 25.5 & 26.3
Mac 10.13.6 & 10.14.6

Anders Hedelin
Posts: 760
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:34 am
Finale Version: Finale 26, 27.4.1
Operating System: Windows

Post by Anders Hedelin » Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:05 pm

David Ward wrote:
Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:32 pm
Actually, in most cases keying ‘A’ may be a safer option than ‘*’ which can hide or show a necessary accidental as well as a cautionary, while ‘A’ will show or hide a cautionary, but won't have any effect on a necessary one.
As an ex-music-theory teacher I think that I might be guilty of rather few accidental accidentals, but thanks all the same. I wasn't aware of the difference between * and A.
Finale 26.3, 27.4.1
Windows 10

User avatar
motet
Posts: 8292
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:33 pm
Finale Version: 2014.5,2011,2005,27
Operating System: Windows

Post by motet » Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:10 pm

Having accidentally hidden a non-courtesy (rude?) accidental before, I now use only A.

Anders Hedelin
Posts: 760
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:34 am
Finale Version: Finale 26, 27.4.1
Operating System: Windows

Post by Anders Hedelin » Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:15 pm

Accidentally rude accidentals - you wouldn't want to use them, would you.
Finale 26.3, 27.4.1
Windows 10

User avatar
motet
Posts: 8292
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:33 pm
Finale Version: 2014.5,2011,2005,27
Operating System: Windows

Post by motet » Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:46 pm

Hah!

Really, the only need for * is perhaps turning off a double accidental in a multi-layer situation.

musicus
Posts: 833
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 11:12 pm
Finale Version: Finale v26
Operating System: Mac

Post by musicus » Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:55 pm

What qualifies an accidental as being rude?
motet wrote:
Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:10 pm
Having accidentally hidden a non-courtesy (rude?) accidental before, I now use only A.

Anders Hedelin
Posts: 760
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:34 am
Finale Version: Finale 26, 27.4.1
Operating System: Windows

Post by Anders Hedelin » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:06 pm

Good question. To be serious: it could be one accidental too many, possibly insulting the intelligence of the musician. Then the musicians I've talked with seem to think that too much information is preferable to too little.
Finale 26.3, 27.4.1
Windows 10

User avatar
motet
Posts: 8292
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:33 pm
Finale Version: 2014.5,2011,2005,27
Operating System: Windows

Post by motet » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:16 pm

Except for the multi-layer situation I mentioned, I can't envision ever removing an accidental which must be there according to notation rules and which Finale implements (i.e., the first accidental of that note in that measure).

Anders Hedelin
Posts: 760
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:34 am
Finale Version: Finale 26, 27.4.1
Operating System: Windows

Post by Anders Hedelin » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:41 pm

To complicate matters a little bit more, this is a situation where Finale doesn't automatically get it. I don't take it as rude though, but here's an accidental needed because of the new octave (the D sharp on the next to last note):
Needed accidental.PNG
Needed accidental.PNG (69.52 KiB) Viewed 2782 times
Finale 26.3, 27.4.1
Windows 10

User avatar
motet
Posts: 8292
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:33 pm
Finale Version: 2014.5,2011,2005,27
Operating System: Windows

Post by motet » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:48 pm

Right, but A will do that. I'm talking about suppressing an accidental that Finale supplies, for which you need * (and which should be rare).

Anders Hedelin
Posts: 760
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:34 am
Finale Version: Finale 26, 27.4.1
Operating System: Windows

Post by Anders Hedelin » Sun Dec 13, 2020 8:04 pm

I'll check that out the next time I need it.
Finale 26.3, 27.4.1
Windows 10

Post Reply