Tablature Weirdness

[Westlyn]

I turn to my Finale friends once again to figure out this problem.

Many of the arrangements I write are for solo guitar and I'm using both standard notation and tablature.

When I'm playing two notes at once, on adjacent strings, the two strings are somehow connected and will only accept one number. For example, I'm playing a C on the 2nd string/1st fret and an A on the 3rd string/2nd fret, I can get two 1's in the TAB or two 2's, but not a 2 on the 3rd string and a 1 on the 2nd string. It seems that it happens most often when the rhythm involves triplets.

Thanks in advance of any insights.

Jim Westlyn

[Peter Thomsen]

Attach the Finale document here - and I am confident the gurus can find the culprit.

[Westlyn]

It's always terrific how quickly the members of this forum respond. Thank You!

I've attached my arrangement of Gershwin's Our Love is Here to Stay

LoveStay.musx

(132.85 KiB) Downloaded 74 times

.

The problem shows itself in measure 13. Notice it works fine once I get to the quarter note rhythm.

Jim Westlyn

[zuill]

I revised the TAB in that measure. Is this what you want?

How do you create the TAB notes? Do you copy/paste from the top staff?

Zuill

[Peter Thomsen]

Jim Westlyn,

I modified your Finale document.
* Attached.

Take a look at it, and play it back, to hear the result.

For me, this modified document works without problems.

[Westlyn]

Zuill:

Yeah, that works. But what did you do differently?
I tried it again and the software won't allow me to select the two tab numbers one at a time.
I always input the TAB manually and separately.

Peter:

I know you; you've helped me out in the past.

I'll ask the same of you as I have Zuill: Why didn't it work that way for me? The triplets seems to trigger the problem.

Thanks to both of you for the assist.

Jim Westlyn

[zuill]

I used Simple Entry yo make the changes. I was able to select each number individually and use the + or - keys to make the change.

Zuill

[Westlyn]

Hey Zuill:

Thanks for the quick reply.

I have done that same thing, but if I try to select one... they turn a reddish color when selected...
they both show as selected and changing one changes the other.

Why would my software react/respond any differently than yours?

I think I called it right... It's Weirdness!

Jim

[zuill]

If you select and both are red, try Ctrl-Arrow to go to one or the other. Ctrl-Up Arrow will highlight just the upper number. Ctrl-Down Arrow will select the lower number. If this does not work, then maybe your preferences are corrupted.

Zuill

[Peter Thomsen]

… Peter:

I know you; you've helped me out in the past.

I'll ask the same of you as I have Zuill: Why didn't it work that way for me? …

I do not know why it did not work that way for you.

* Did you examine the Finale document I attached?

In your attached Finale document I noticed that you had muted the TAB staff.
When I un-muted the TAB staff, I found that playback was incorrect in the TAB staff.

I corrected the TAB staff, and now it works for me, both layout and playback.
I could simply copy the music from standard staff to TAB staff.

[zuill]

… Peter:

I know you; you've helped me out in the past.

I'll ask the same of you as I have Zuill: Why didn't it work that way for me? …

I do not know why it did not work that way for you.

* Did you examine the Finale document I attached?

In your attached Finale document I noticed that you had muted the TAB staff.
When I un-muted the TAB staff, I found that playback was incorrect in the TAB staff.

I corrected the TAB staff, and now it works for me, both layout and playback.
I could simply copy the music from standard staff to TAB staff.

Peter,

I believe the reason the TAB staff is muted is that the notation staff is the actual playback sound, but the TAB staff sounds a minor third lower than what should match the notation staff because there is a Capo on the third fret. When one plays at fret 5 on the E string without the Capo, it sounds an A. However, with a Capo at fret 3, the note now sounds as a C. So, I figure when working, it would sound confusing to be hearing the sounding notes (top staff) with the TAB notes. I suppose one could use a transposition to get the sounds to match, but Westlyn chose to not worry about that.

Zuill

[zuill]

I tested things further. Getting TAB playback to match the standard notation can be done 2 ways:

1. Set the TAB transposition to down a m3. When pasting to that staff, choose lowest fret as 3.

2. Change the TAB pitch definitions to 3 half steps (numbers) higher. So, set the high E to 67, instead of 64. Do the same for all the strings. When pasting, choose 0 as the lowest fret. This appears to be the method Peter used.

Either way, now playback should match. Also, even though in Peter's fixed file TAB numbers create the correct pitch, I see that in Westlyn's file, the choice of frets is more efficient for playing. In my picture (attached), I show both results of the first measure for comparison.

Zuill

[zuill]

I realized that, after creating a custom Tab for Drop D tuning at Capo III that there is an easier way, without customizing the numbers manually (ad 3 to each). There is a slot for indicating the Capo fret number. After selecting Drop D tuning, just enter 3 in the Capo slot and you get the proper result.

Attached is a template demonstrating what I did.

Zuill

[zuill]

I took the original file posted, changed the TAB to the Drop D tuning set to Capo 3, and tried to find the erroneous TAB notes. I don't know that I found them all. I tried. I also set playback to start at Measure 1, and I turned off playback of Chord Symbols and unmuted the TAB playback, so that mistakes between the 2 staves can be exposed, if there are any.

Zuill

[Westlyn]

Zuill:

Wow, you put a lot of time and effort into this. I do appreciate it.

Very rarely do I play back my guitar arrangements from the software; they always sound to my ear stiff and un-flowing.
So I never gave the transposition issue much attention. Maybe now, with all the info you've offered, I might give it some more attention.

If you discover there's any way I can repay your efforts, don't hesitate...

Jim

[zuill]

I found a couple of notes that I missed before, so here's the updated file.

I learned some things doing this, which is payment enough. If you don't want the arrangement to stay here, I can delete them after you download them.

Zuill

[Westlyn]

I sell these arrangements to students sometimes, so you're more than welcome to keep it. Use it for "educational purposes" only.

Are you a guitarist?

You can contact me at my email: jim@jimwestlyn.com if you want.

[zuill]

Not a guitarist, but have worked with many of them over the years. I dabble at the guitar, but your arrangement is beyond my abilities. Piano is my instrument, primarily.

Zuill

[Westlyn]

My relationship to the piano mirrors yours to the guitar; I'm just good enough to be dangerous.

Thanks again for all the help.