Still having problems with default file

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mark carlson
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Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:47 pm

I solved most of the problems I was having earlier with my default file. But this is still plaguing me:

I have been carefully editing my default file, that is, Maestro Font Default.musx, and carefully "save as" in order to overwrite what was already there. But now when I open a new file using Setup Wizard, none of the things I have saved actually show up at all: the page margins are different, the system margins are different, the copyright notice is different, etc.

I'm attaching here my "Maestro Font Default.musx" file and my most recent attempt at setting up a new file, called "New File.musx".

Can anyone help me figure out why my new files don't open with the things I have set up in my default file?

Thank you!

Mark Carlson
Finale 26.3
OS 11.6
Attachments
New File.musx
(101.26 KiB) Downloaded 88 times
Maestro Font Default.musx
(99.81 KiB) Downloaded 87 times

Re: Still having problems with default file

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motet
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Mon Sep 20, 2021 5:06 pm

I think we figured it out in the previous thread, but you never followed through so perhaps you missed it or misunderstood. New/Default Document and the Set-Up Wizard use two different things. You have modified the former. For the latter, you want a file called Engraved Style.ftmx. But I would suggest leaving that file alone and adding a new one in the Document Styles directory. As an example, I put a new file there called Mark Carlson and as you can see it now shows up in the Wizard. Or, if you plan to have several, make a new folder and put your templates there.

The location of the Document Styles folder is shown in Preferences/Folders.
0991.png
0993.png

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:05 pm

mark carlson wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:47 pm
I solved most of the problems I was having earlier with my default file. But this is still plaguing me:

I have been carefully editing my default file, that is, Maestro Font Default.musx, and carefully "save as" in order to overwrite what was already there. But now when I open a new file using Setup Wizard, none of the things I have saved actually show up at all: the page margins are different, the system margins are different, the copyright notice is different, etc.

I'm attaching here my "Maestro Font Default.musx" file and my most recent attempt at setting up a new file, called "New File.musx".

Can anyone help me figure out why my new files don't open with the things I have set up in my default file?

Thank you!

Mark Carlson
Finale 26.3
OS 11.6
motet wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 5:06 pm
I think we figured it out in the previous thread, but you never followed through so perhaps you missed it or misunderstood. New/Default Document and the Set-Up Wizard use two different things. You have modified the former. For the latter, you want a file called Engraved Style.ftmx. But I would suggest leaving that file alone and adding a new one in the Document Styles directory. As an example, I put a new file there called Mark Carlson and as you can see it now shows up in the Wizard. Or, if you plan to have several, make a new folder and put your templates there.

The location of the Document Styles folder is shown in Preferences/Folders.
0991.png
0993.png
Thank you, motet! Yes, I clearly did not understand what we went through earlier. I thought it was all about being able to access the Maestro Font Default file and editing it. I sincerely do not understand why we need to have two separate default files to make this work. Why is that?!?

But aside from that, I don't have any idea what an .ftmx file is nor how to create it. I've never seen that extension before. Can you advise me, please? I have located the Document Styles directory, but there aren't any .ftmx files in it.

Unfortunately, the instructions in the manual say that saving one's default preferences is all a matter of revising one's Maestro Font Default file. I sure wish they would bother to mention other necessary steps. (https://usermanuals.finalemusic.com/Fin ... cument.htm)

I apologize for evidently being so dense about this, but I just don't get it.

with thanks,

Mark

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motet
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:32 pm

When you do a Save As, save as type "Finale Template File." (In reality, .ftmx and .musx files are the same, just with a different extension, so I suppose you could rename them with the OS, too).

The default file is just a quick way to create something to play around with. I use it all the time to answer questions here. The templates that the Set-Up Wizard user are more flexible in that you can choose among many. It might be a good idea to leave the MakeMusic versions alone in case there's every any reason to suspect your own templates and you need a reality check.

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:44 pm

motet wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:32 pm
When you do a Save As, save as type "Finale Template File." (In reality, .ftmx and .musx files are the same, just with a different extension, so I suppose you could rename them with the OS, too).

The default file is just a quick way to create something to play around with. I use it all the time to answer questions here. The templates that the Set-Up Wizard user are more flexible in that you can choose among many. It might be a good idea to leave the MakeMusic versions alone in case there's every any reason to suspect your own templates and you need a reality check.
Thank you.

I made a new Engraved Style template, and now, when I open a new file, my staff height has been reduced from .25", as I set it, to .11", and there is only one system per page. The page margins and system margins are not at all what I set, and so on. I'll attach my new Engraved Style and the new file that resulted from opening a new document.

I sure must be doing something wrong!

Mark
Attachments
Experiment.musx
(101.18 KiB) Downloaded 90 times
Engraved Style.musx
(100.97 KiB) Downloaded 88 times

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motet
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:56 pm


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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:03 pm

mark carlson wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:44 pm
when I open a new file, my staff height has been reduced from .25", as I set it, to .11", and there is only one system per page.
How are you opening a new file? There are many ways.

I made a new folder called Custom in the Document Styles folder and saved your Engraved Style there as a .ftmx template called Mark Carlson. Again, I suggest you do this rather than overwriting the file that comes with Finale. When I used your template in the Setup Wizard I did not get shrunken staves.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:21 pm

motet wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:03 pm
mark carlson wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:44 pm
when I open a new file, my staff height has been reduced from .25", as I set it, to .11", and there is only one system per page.
How are you opening a new file? There are many ways.

I made a new folder called Custom in the Document Styles folder and saved your Engraved Style there as a .ftmx template called Mark Carlson. Again, I suggest you do this rather than overwriting the file that comes with Finale. When I used your template in the Setup Wizard I did not get shrunken staves.
I opened it the only way I know how to open a new document: Command-N, which opens the Setup Wizard. Is that not a good way to open a new file?

But since I have already overwritten the file that comes with Finale, what can I do now?

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:27 pm

It's a fine way of opening a file, but there are others, which is why I asked. Just getting it straight what you're doing.

The file you attached is Engraved Style.musx. But shouldn't it be .ftmx? Look in the Document Styles folder with the Mac finder (Preferences/Folders will tell you where that is) and see what else is there. Perhaps you're not using the file you think you are.

Someone with a Mac can assist you, but I believe those files are in two places, a system-wide place and a per-user place. You can perhaps use the system-wide version to replace the one you overwrote. If you did overwrite it.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:32 pm

I think that ftmx must be a Windows thing, because when I tried to save my Engraved Style file as ftmx, the file ended up being named "Engraved Style.ftmx.musx"

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:33 pm

motet wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:27 pm
It's a fine way of opening a file, but there are others, which is why I asked. Just getting it straight what you're doing.

The file you attached is Engraved Style.musx. But shouldn't it be .ftmx? Look in the Document Styles folder with the Mac finder (Preferences/Folders will tell you where that is) and see what else is there. Perhaps you're not using the file you think you are.

Someone with a Mac can assist you, but I believe those files are in two places, a system-wide place and a per-user place. You can perhaps use the system-wide version to replace the one you overwrote. If you did overwrite it.
Thanks so much. I hope someone who uses a Mac will chime in here.

Mark

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:18 pm

You can't just type in .ftmx - whatever you type becomes part of the file name. Instead, somewhere there's a drop-down menu that tells it what type to save it as. Look around on the Save As dialog. Once you find that, just type in Engraved Style for the name.

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by Peter Thomsen » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:26 pm

Indeed the file name extension .ftmx is not needed in Mac Finale.

For templates in Mac Finale, just use the extension .musx, and put the Finale document in the Document Styles folder, or in the Default Files folder, or in the Templates folder.

The different folders are for different {File menu > New} commands.

{File menu > New > Document with Setup Wizard…} uses the Document Styles folder.

{File menu > New > Default Document} uses the (user specified) Default Document (located in the Default Files folder).

{File menu > New > Document from Template…} uses the Templates folder.
Mac OS X 11.5.2 (Big Sur), Finale user since 1996

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:42 pm

motet wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:18 pm
You can't just type in .ftmx - whatever you type becomes part of the file name. Instead, somewhere there's a drop-down menu that tells it what type to save it as. Look around on the Save As dialog. Once you find that, just type in Engraved Style for the name.
I tried, but there aren't any options for that. Any music file on the Mac is saved as musx.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:53 pm

Peter Thomsen wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:26 pm
Indeed the file name extension .ftmx is not needed in Mac Finale.

For templates in Mac Finale, just use the extension .musx, and put the Finale document in the Document Styles folder, or in the Default Files folder, or in the Templates folder.

The different folders are for different {File menu > New} commands.

{File menu > New > Document with Setup Wizard…} uses the Document Styles folder.

{File menu > New > Default Document} uses the (user specified) Default Document (located in the Default Files folder).

{File menu > New > Document from Template…} uses the Templates folder.
Thank you. I have done all of that correctly.

Might you have any clue as to why, when I open a new file with the Setup Wizard, nothing that I saved in my Engraved Style file in my Documents Styles folder is actually there? I'll attach my Engraved Style file, a new document, "Experiment", in which pretty much everything is wrong (the .25" staff height reduced to .11", wrong page and system margins, etc), and one in which some things are right, but mostly not, "Piano Experiment".

I appreciate your help!

Mark
Attachments
Piano Experiment.musx
(101.67 KiB) Downloaded 71 times
Experiment.musx
(101.18 KiB) Downloaded 68 times
Engraved Style.musx
(100.97 KiB) Downloaded 72 times

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Peter Thomsen
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by Peter Thomsen » Tue Sep 21, 2021 5:06 am

mark carlson wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:53 pm
… Might you have any clue as to why, when I open a new file with the Setup Wizard, nothing that I saved in my Engraved Style file in my Documents Styles folder is actually there? …
My first guess would be that you are using the wrong Document Styles folder.

There are two identically named Finale folder hierarchies.

One resides in the root level Library folder. This one serves as a backup for the Finale program.

The other resides in the (often hidden) Library folder in your user account. This is where you should put your custom templates.
How to get there:
Hold down the Option key, and pull down Finder’s Go menu.
Because of the Option key being pressed, the (user account’s) Library folder appears in the Go menu.
Mac OS X 11.5.2 (Big Sur), Finale user since 1996

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:53 pm

Peter Thomsen wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 5:06 am
mark carlson wrote:
Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:53 pm
… Might you have any clue as to why, when I open a new file with the Setup Wizard, nothing that I saved in my Engraved Style file in my Documents Styles folder is actually there? …
My first guess would be that you are using the wrong Document Styles folder.

There are two identically named Finale folder hierarchies.

One resides in the root level Library folder. This one serves as a backup for the Finale program.

The other resides in the (often hidden) Library folder in your user account. This is where you should put your custom templates.
How to get there:
Hold down the Option key, and pull down Finder’s Go menu.
Because of the Option key being pressed, the (user account’s) Library folder appears in the Go menu.
The root level library doesn't have a Finale default file in it, as far as I can tell. (See screenshot attached).

The other two screenshots I am attaching show the location of the files I edited, and which seem to be causing me trouble in opening a new file.

Does this provide any insight?

Thanks!
Attachments
Screen Shot Document Styles Folder.png
Screen Shot Document Files.png
Screen Shot Root Library.png

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motet
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:07 pm

Please look at Preferences/Folders, look at the complete paths listed therein, and make sure that's what you're editing.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:44 pm

motet wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:07 pm
Please look at Preferences/Folders, look at the complete paths listed therein, and make sure that's what you're editing.
Yes, I have checked and rechecked and rechecked again the paths listed in Preferences/Folders, and I am certain of the files I am editing.
Obviously, I am doing something wrong, but it isn't editing the wrong files. I am at my wits end about this.

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:56 pm

Try creating a subfolder in the Document Styles folder, called Custom or Mark or somesuch, put some files in there, and see if it shows up in the Setup Wizard.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:11 pm

motet wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:56 pm
Try creating a subfolder in the Document Styles folder, called Custom or Mark or somesuch, put some files in there, and see if it shows up in the Setup Wizard.
I tried and am still getting the same weird new document. Damn.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:17 pm

I'm trying my best to get help from Make Music on this, and if anything ever comes of it, I'll let you all know. But it's really difficult to get them to respond.

I submitted a trouble ticket on Sept. 20 (10 days ago); I received a response on the 22nd with questions, which I answered immediately; on the 24th, after not receiving any answer, I politely asked the tech support guy if he was going to follow through on this trouble ticket; FOUR DAYS later, on the 28th, he finally responded, asked more questions, and I answered immediately. I have not heard from him since. Are they always this terrible at responding?

I hope not, but this sure is frustrating!

Mark

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:14 pm

mark carlson wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:11 pm
motet wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:56 pm
Try creating a subfolder in the Document Styles folder, called Custom or Mark or somesuch, put some files in there, and see if it shows up in the Setup Wizard.
I tried and am still getting the same weird new document. Damn.
Did the new subfolder show up in the Setup Wizard? Try putting your customized file in there, then choose that when you run the Wizard.

mark carlson
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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by mark carlson » Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:55 pm

motet wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:14 pm
mark carlson wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:11 pm
motet wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:56 pm
Try creating a subfolder in the Document Styles folder, called Custom or Mark or somesuch, put some files in there, and see if it shows up in the Setup Wizard.
I tried and am still getting the same weird new document. Damn.
Did the new subfolder show up in the Setup Wizard? Try putting your customized file in there, then choose that when you run the Wizard.
It didn't, but I am not sure I know how to choose that when I run the Wizard. In fact, I don't know how. It doesn't give any options, as far as I know--just Engraved Style or Handwritten style. Those are the only things that ever show up in Setup Wizard.

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Re: Still having problems with default file

Post by motet » Fri Oct 01, 2021 12:03 am

That means you're putting it in the wrong place. You might try rereading this thread again. I've explained how to find out where the Document Styles folder is and where to choose the style in the Setup Wizard, so I don't want to do that again.

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