O/T orchestral parts question

[Michel R E]

obviously, it's best to have good page turns in an orchestral part because chances are the musicians will have had minimal rehearsal time.

However... when it comes to the soloists part in a concerto, does it matter QUITE as much? Technically, shouldn't a soloist have their music (mostly) memorized for a concerto or concertante work?

[David Ward]

I would agree that even if the solo part is not fully memorized you *ought* to be able to get away with turns that are inferior to those that you'd expect in an orchestral part. Nowadays with PDFs and photocopies a soloist should be able to find their own way round ‘impossible’ turns, even without relying on memory. Several years ago now, Tasmin Little played a substantial violin concerto live at the BBC Proms using an iPad.

However, unless you've discussed this with the soloist, you probably shouldn't expect the solo part to be fully memorized. None of my various concertos and concertante pieces have had their first performances from memory (and I was lucky enough to be able to ensure good turns, although in two cases I needed a larger page size for the soloist than was used for the orchestral parts – almost all hand-copied).

Some very good players don't memorize much of the repertoire, for others it is normal. Sviatislav Richter refused to memorize anything much, as he claimed it would clutter the brain and place severe limits on the range of his repertoire.

In the 1970s I saw Alfred Brendel playing the Bartók second piano concerto with the sheet music (Boulez conducting), although Brendel did memorize much of the classical repertoire.

On the other hand there are performers who seem to be able to memorize almost anything after a single play-through.

[motet]

Paging John Ruggero...

[Peter Thomsen]

Using a tablet computer in combination with some sort of page turning device has become quite common nowadays.

[Michel R E]

Paging John Ruggero...

ooooo, double-sense! love the pun, intentional or otherwise!

[Ian Stewart]

Whether or not soloists memorise the solo part they still have to practise the part from the music. I think achievable page turns are good practice anyway. However I worked with one exceptional cellist, who cut her prominent part into several small slithers of paper, then stuck them together in a way that to me looked random but to her was perfectly logical.

[John Ruggero]

I just heard something. Is someone paging me?

I think that Ian hit the nail on the head when he points out that a concerto soloist practices from the music even when they are going to perform from memory. Inferior page turns can have an adverse effect on the learning process, technique, and interpretation of all genres of music. If one has to interrupt the musical thought and physical action by dealing with an awkward turn, how can it not?

And in most cases, it is so easy to provide good turns. Why wouldn't one? Wouldn't that be self-defeating?

Incidentally, Richter performed with music mostly at the end of his career, as a memory aid, not that there is a thing wrong with using music in a public performance.

[Michel R E]

I'm just finding that I can't put decent page turns in the soloist's part.

I mean, yes, I have a few that are ok, but then one VERY tight one, and then there's a perpetuum mobile section where it's simply impossible to find anywhere to insert a page turn.

[Hector Pascal]

I sometimes have no choice other than to use a 3 page spread if the music doesn't allow for page turns. I usually can find a break after three pages.

Cheerio,
Hector.
Edit: Back in the 90's, I attended a solo flute performance where the performer had the music positioned on approx.10 music stands that stretched across the entire stage! It was interesting to watch the performance because one could see how much longer the music was going to go on for, notwithstanding any repeats! Unfortunately, during the performance, a very gusty breeze entered via the stage door and sent all the music whirling into the air.

[David Ward]

A brilliant and versatile violinist with whom I've worked on a number of occasions, but who prefers not to rely on memory, has a long piece of cardboard(?) to which the pages of the D minor chaconne are pasted so it can sit safely across three music stands.

[John Ruggero]

Three or four fold out pages if necessary. I trim the margins to reduce the lateral size and tape with masking tape. That was a trick Arnstein taught me. It holds up over many years and doesn't break through. You might look at the last movement of the violin part to Ravel's violin sonata no. 2. They used every trick in the book to get it on two facing pages. I have it in the old large French-sized music and they got 15 staves on each page at a decent although slightly-reduced size. That is also something to consider, just for the solo part.

[Michel R E]

thanks John, I'll have to look where exactly the "impossible page turns" occur in the part. Maybe using a larger paper size might work. I know the publisher can do this.
Right now all my orchestral parts are on standard 9x12.
I could try 9.5x12.5 (standard keyboard score size here.)

[Michel R E]

I was finally able to add a "fold-out" page to the middle of the violin solo part. And it actually helped a lot. It turned the middle movement into a 3 page layout, then the verso of that fold out served as the 1st page of the final movement.

There are still some rather tight page turns, MOST I think can be handled.

[motet]

For taping music together I like the linen hingeing tape that artists and photographers use, since it's archival quality and designed to be used for just this purpose of making a "hinge." The brand I use is Lineco (the self-adhesive variety, not the kind you wet). Some tape will yellow or the glue will fail, or it will crack at the hinge after too many foldings. I tried the 3M Micropore tape that some people use for music and it discolored after about a year. "Artist's tape" is of archival quality, I guess, but it's kind of thick and doesn't want to fold flat. Lineco also makes "hingeing tissue" that's used in framing mattes, but I like the linen tape.

Of course the really professional way would be to print those pages on a larger piece of paper and fold it.

[John Ruggero]

Masking tape is more for everyday use, like putting photocopies together accordion style etc. because it holds up amazingly well and doesn't break through, even after years of use. Its reliability is why Arnstein used it for the fold-out pages in orchestral parts that were getting hard use in opera houses and would eventually be replaced by the publisher. But it is certainly not archival because, eventually the glue becomes brittle, and the tape falls off leaving a dark area where it has reacted to the paper. But then it is easily replaced. The Lineco tape sounds like a great solution, although probably more expensive.

[Michel R E]

Unfortunately, I don't remember what type of tape they use at my printers'.
I've made performance material in the past that required fold-out pages, but they've always been sent directly to the orchestra librarians, so I don't have any lying around the house.

[bkshepard]

I've been using the "Music Binding Tape" from Vital Presentations Concepts for years and have had great success with it. I find it less brittle than masking tape over time. It comes in a variety of pre-measured strips, or you can get it in a continuous roll. They also make a binding machine that uses that tape, but I don't need to tape that many parts so I just do it by hand.

[motet]

The Lineco tape is indeed rather expensive for fan-folding photocopies. It's about $30 for 1-1/4" x 150'. I also cut it into 1-1/2" x 1/2" pieces for reinforcement at the staple points on the cover and the innermost sheet of a booklet for rental music, since rental materials are not always respected, and have never had a page tear out.