Contra Bass or Double Bass?

[John Ruggero]

Anyone mentioned "bass viol", the granddaddy of them all? Also, Violone, and bass violin, although bass violin doesn't seem correct since I don't think the contrabass is part of the violin family.

One could get away with gut bucket by abbreviating it G.B. for Great Bass.

[ttw]

As in "Great Bass and Little Fishes"?

[motet]

I would abbreviate Contrabass "Cb.", lowercase b.

[Tomas E]

Me too. Already done.

[Tomas E]

In general it seems as if the trend goes towards English instrument names instead of Italian ones, am I right?

[BuonTempi]

Anyone mentioned "bass viol", the granddaddy of them all? Also, Violone, and bass violin, although bass violin doesn't seem correct since I don't think the contrabass is part of the violin family.

I always think it's funny that "Violoncello" means "Little Violone", and of course Violone mean "Big Viol".

[AnneMillington]

I write for string quintet, and in this context I like to use Contrabass, abbreviated as Cb. This is consistent with Violoncello, abbreviated as Vc, Viola as Va, and Violin I and Violin II, abbreviated as Vn I and Vn II. All 2 letter abbreviations with consistent rules. There. Now you know my private little OCD secret.

But I play cello and bass and that's what I call them. Cello and bass. Not even an apostrophe!

[N Grossingink]

Probably in a Bluegrass music setting, the bass can sometimes be referred to as a "Bull Fiddle".

[John Ruggero]

I like to use Contrabass, abbreviated as Cb. This is consistent with Violoncello, abbreviated as Vc, Viola as Va, and Violin I and Violin II, abbreviated as Vn I and Vn II.

Nothing OCD there. I think that system is often used.

Arnold Arnstein took the opposite approach and wanted each of the instrument labels to be as dissimilar from each other as possible as a visual aid to the conductor. So he used Vln 1, Vln 2, Viola, Cello, Bass. Note that each of them except the bass has 5 "characters": nice and even. He didn't see the point in abbreviating such short words, especially since the Vln 1 and Vln 2 determined the left margin in any case.

[motet]

I use "contrabass."

I remember reading that the "double" in "double bass" refers to doubling the cello or the continuo, but I can't find where I read that. I do remember thinking at the time it sounded like folk--i.e. bogus--etymology, and indeed it may not be true. But if it is, then "double bassoon" or odouble clarinet" may not be good analogies.

[Peter Thomsen]

… I remember reading that the "double" in "double bass" refers to doubling the cello or the continuo, but I can't find where I read that. I do remember thinking at the time it sounded like folk--i.e. bogus--etymology, and indeed it may not be true …

As Far As I Know, the term ‘double bass’ in this usage means an octave lower than the usual bass register (and hence the instrument’s bigger, “double” size).

[David Ward]

FWIW (almost nothing, I suspect) I use ‘Double Bass’ abbreviated to ‘D.B.’ or ‘D.Bs.’ and ‘Double Bassoon’ abbreviated to ‘D. Bsn.’, but I have ‘Contrabass Clarinet’ abbreviated to ‘Cb. Clar.’, which is inconsistent. However, this inconsistency does not bother me at all, as I have never tried to be a style purist.

My point is, as long as it's understood, it shouldn't matter whether it's ‘contra’ or ‘double’.

[mknoll]

I always think it's funny that "Violoncello" means "Little Violone", and of course Violone mean "Big Viol".

Of course, Bach sometimes calls for a violoncello piccolo, a "little small large viol."

[AnneMillington]

Arnold Arnstein took the opposite approach and wanted each of the instrument labels to be as dissimilar from each other as possible as a visual aid to the conductor. So he used Vln 1, Vln 2, Viola, Cello, Bass. Note that each of them except the bass has 5 "characters": nice and even. He didn't see the point in abbreviating such short words, especially since the Vln 1 and Vln 2 determined the left margin in any case.

Makes a lot of sense, and very thoughtful!

[motet]

… I remember reading that the "double" in "double bass" refers to doubling the cello or the continuo, but I can't find where I read that. I do remember thinking at the time it sounded like folk--i.e. bogus--etymology, and indeed it may not be true …

As Far As I Know, the term ‘double bass’ in this usage means an octave lower than the usual bass register (and hence the instrument’s bigger, “double” size).

I found this on the Oxford University Press website (publishers of the Grove Dictionary):

The origin of the name of the double bass stems from the fact that its initial function was to double the bass line of large ensembles.

https://blog.oup.com/2015/05/double-bass/

[Peter Thomsen]

There seems to be disagreement about that very question.

According to Wikipedia:
The names contrabass and double bass refer to the instrument's range and use one octave lower than the cello (i.e. doubling on cello).

Quoting an old forum post from ten years ago, posted by forum user Epilogue:
… When looking at various bass blogs and forums on the internet, I’ve noticed some massive confusion about the term ‘double bass’. One thing that became apparent to me from the outset is the amount of people who just…make-up-stuff…without doing any research. The most outlandish falsehood spreading-around is that the word ‘double’ in ‘double bass’ is somehow a reference to its’ doubling another instrument in an orchestra. That is simply NOT true – never has been and never will be! Who ever started that rumor should not be shot, but perhaps grazed a little. It reminds me of comedian Steve Martin’s stand-up routine from a few decades ago when out-of-the-blue he suddenly says, “Always have REALLY strong opinions about things you know NOTHING about!” The term ‘double bass’ in this usage means an octave lower than the usual bass register …

[motet]

The Oxford English Dictionary says of "double"

4.b.
1654–
Music. In names of musical instruments, organ stops, etc.: Sounding an octave lower in pitch.
(A pipe, string, etc. of twice the length of another (ceteris paribus) gives a note an octave lower; hence this use.)

and gives "double bassoon" as an example. So touché!

[Tomas E]

It's always been my understanding that Contra refers to its range while Double refers to what it does.

To me that seems to be the most logical explanation.

Does anyone say "these notes should be played in the double octave"?

Furthermore we have the sub-contra octave. Does anyone say sub-double octave?

[mknoll]

Organologically, instruments that play an octave lower than written are 16-foot instruments, while those that play at written pitch are 8-foot instruments. I've always assumed that's where the "double" comes from.

[Anders Hedelin]

There seems to be disagreement about that very question.

According to Wikipedia:
The names contrabass and double bass refer to the instrument's range and use one octave lower than the cello (i.e. doubling on cello).

Quoting an old forum post from ten years ago, posted by forum user Epilogue:
… When looking at various bass blogs and forums on the internet, I’ve noticed some massive confusion about the term ‘double bass’. One thing that became apparent to me from the outset is the amount of people who just…make-up-stuff…without doing any research. The most outlandish falsehood spreading-around is that the word ‘double’ in ‘double bass’ is somehow a reference to its’ doubling another instrument in an orchestra. That is simply NOT true – never has been and never will be! Who ever started that rumor should not be shot, but perhaps grazed a little. It reminds me of comedian Steve Martin’s stand-up routine from a few decades ago when out-of-the-blue he suddenly says, “Always have REALLY strong opinions about things you know NOTHING about!” The term ‘double bass’ in this usage means an octave lower than the usual bass register …

Another, somewhat less "bloggy" quote than the one from Epilogue, here from Groves:

"Double". An adjective used to indicate a lower octave. Thus the double bassoon plays in the octave below the bassoon, the double bass an octave below the violoncello and so on. This usage derives from the old practice of identifying notes below gamma ut (the G on the bottom line of the bass stave) by double letters, FF, EE and so on. Organ builders still refer to these low pitches as ‘double F’, ‘double E’ etc. ‘Double harp’ (arpa doppia) signifies a harp with more than one rank of strings ( see Harp, §V, 5 ).

Keyboard instruments with two manuals are called ‘double’. But in the 16th and 17th centuries the terms ‘double harpsichord’, ‘double regals’, ‘double virginals’ or even ‘double curtall’ (and also the Doppelfagott mentioned by Praetorius in 1619) more often referred to instruments whose ranges extended below gamma ut. For further information see F.W. Galpin: Old English Instruments of Music (London, 4/1965), 212ff.

Needless to say 'contra' as in 'contrabassoon' etc. also means in the lower octave. So the there doesn't seem to be much point in finding a distinction between 'double' and 'contra' in this situation. Music language is loaded with 'double expressions' for the same thing, or with 'double meanings' of the same expression (pun intended).