adding fingerings

[lynndavidnewton]

When adding instrument fingerings, do most people use the numbers that are in the Articulations Selection box? Sometime recently I thought I saw small numbers somewhere else and wondered if maybe I've been using the wrong thing. Now I don't see them where I thought I did. I'm not using the default font at the moment, so that may explain why I don't see them elsewhere, e.g. in a place under Expression Selection. (Like under Technique Text for instance.)

One problem with this is that I tend to add a whole string of them after the bulk of the music is done, and by default, the numbers are far down on the chart, so in order to do less scrolling and eyeball searching, I simply moved them to the very top of the articulations list. But there's a caveat to that in that the order of stacking is prioritized by where these fall in the list. It hasn't been a problem, but I can see that it might be. I wouldn't want a fingering to appear underneath a staccato, for instance.

Comments?

[ebiggs1]

There is a Lua script to do that.

[lynndavidnewton]

Umm ... Forgive my ignorance, but I'm not familiar with Lua scripts.

A quick Google search reveals there are free scripts available ... somewhere ... that do a whole lot that I wish I knew how to do.

Can someone give me a push in the right direction so I don't waste a lot of time? I'm looking at finalelua.com, which is pretty interesting.

I suppose there's a bundle I can download? How are these scripts typically then called up? Is there something added into the menu system like what happens with plug-ins?

Thanks.

[motet]

I'm not sure you need to get into all that. Are the articulations working for you? As long as you keep them in the same order, I don't see a problem with that, but I encourage you to use the articulation metakeys. Just point at the note with the cursor (while in the Articulation tool), press down the number (1 through 5) and click. That way, you need not reorder them.

[lynndavidnewton]

motet: Yes, the articulations have worked fine for me in the past.

Ohmigosh, I didn't know you could do that! Yes, I bumped up the fingering numbers from somewhere down the list up to positions 1-5 on the chart. So with the Articulation Tool selected, I press the number for the finger, click the note I want it on, and ZAP, there it is. How cool! I wish I'd known about that a couple of years ago when I ground out several pages of exercises in which every single note had a fingering number on it.

This list is a treasure. Thanks so much!

And FWIW, I did start following the instructions regarding Lua and downloaded the package, and the instructions don't match the reality, so I'll stop for now. Meanwhile, my fingerings problem is solved.

[John Ruggero]

I couple of other suggestions. If you want your finger numbers to look like what one sees in editions from major publishers, use the Maestro numbers at 12 pt. These are the same numbers that Finale uses for time signatures.

I do a lot of fingering and find it very efficient to assign the metatools so that 1 on the computer keyboard produces the 5th finger number, 2 produces 4, 3 produces 3, 4 produces 2 and G produces 1. In this way the fingers of my left hand can cover these keys and I can "play in" the finger numbers as if I were actually playing those keys with my fingers on a piano keyboard.

[lynndavidnewton]

John Ruggero, that's a clever idea, but what if you're doing fingerings for the right hand?

One thing I found to be tricky with the Articulations fingering numbers is stacking them, e.g. when you have chords and want fingerings for more than one note.

Also there is the case on piano where you press a note with one finger but then switch to another while holding it down for the purposes of sustaining it. Most pianists do that automatically all the time. I'm used to seeing that as the numbers separated by a hyphen, e.g. 5-4, but I don't know how to do that easily either.

[John Ruggero]

Since my right hand is on the mouse, the left hand has to do all the fingering. It's just nice to be able to press with the 5th finger and get a 5 etc. for notes in either hand. Of course, one could also create a duplicate set of finger numbers for the right hand and mouse with the left, but that seems impractical to me.

Versions later than Finale 25 center stacked articulations automatically. I haven't tried it yet myself however to see how it will work for fingering. Motet suggested that one could create a library of stacked fingering combinations and assign them to metatools. The problem is their great number, of course.

I use an elision symbol for finger interchanges, which one sees in most recent urtext editions. I reserve the hyphen for showing trill fingering since I use adjacent finger numbers like 45 to show where two fingers are playing the same key simultaneously.

[motet]

Rather than trying to store all combinations, perhaps two levels--10 articulations--would cover a majority of cases?

[lynndavidnewton]

I'm using Finale v. 27 and I've been using articulation numbers for fingerings, but yesterday when I tried to add multiple fingerings on a chord, they just overlaid one another and I had to drag them into place. A "drag" in more than one way.

Any idea why mine works differently? You are talking about articulation numbers, right?

I play both piano and guitar reasonably well, but for whatever reason, I've never written fingerings in piano music rendered in Finale until yesterday. And the chord fingerings did not stack.

I'll experiment with it some more to see if I can discover if there's some way to make that work.

Meanwhile — an elision symbol — that's one of those underhand slur thingies, right? Such as would be used to mash together two syllables in sung text? How do you do that with fingerings?

This is not an important issue for me since at present I'm looking at only one I'd like to fix in all my music projects. But it's a good thing to know.

[John Ruggero]

Sorry I have no experience with Finale 27 and stacked articulations. I was hoping that it might make life a little easier but haven't tried that version of Finale yet.

You put the two numbers together like this: 45 and then put the elision symbol over or or under it like this:

elisions.png (32.42 KiB) Viewed 1383 times

So there are three operations involved but all can be handled with articulation metatools. Of course, one could make a collection of all the possible elision combinations to speed things up. Probably should have done that a while ago.

[John Ruggero]

Motet, you are right. Once I am finally finished with the current project, I am going to revamp my approach along those lines.

[lynndavidnewton]

John, where is this elision symbol and how do I get it between the finger numbers? The only other type of elision I know about is relative to text, i.e. lyrics, where running syllables together on a single pitch.

Your example looks very nice. There are a couple of symbols in the Articulations table that look kind of like elisions, but I think they are bowing symbols.

The answer is academic for me because I'm OK with just putting two numbers next to each other. In my whole life, I don't think I've ever thought to mark a note to be pressed by two fingers at once. Surely I've played something that way at some time or other but never notated it nor for that matter have I seen it. But slipping an elision symbol in there would look cool and remove any doubt.

[motet]

Rather than two fingers at once, you start with one finger and, keeping the key down, transfer to another finger to facilitate legato moving to the next note.

[John Ruggero]

Motet, lynndavidnewton was referring to a previous comment where I mentioned that I have a special notation for showing two or more fingers depressing the same key simultaneously. It's simply two numbers placed together like 45. This technique gives greater stability to the hand when, for example, one jumps down to play a low black key with the left hand.

The elisions symbols are placed under or over the two finger numbers with the mouse, not typed in between like a hyphen. The elision symbols are articulations that can be found in the Engraver Font set.

[lynndavidnewton]

motet, yes, I'm familiar with that of course and play that way all the time myself. But in an earlier post, John referred to his method of noting cases where two fingers play the same key. I'm guessing it would often be 4 and 5 for strength. I don't think I'd ever bother to notate that, though, unless it was in an instructional fragment.

[motet]

Ah, got it. Sorry for the misunderstanding.