Finale not swinging in 12/8
Moderators: Peter Thomsen, miker
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- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:59 pm
- Finale Version: 25
- Operating System: Mac
Hello all!
So I'm arranging a 12/8 blues for big band and no matter what I do, human playback doesn't swing. 8th and 16th notes come out straight no matter what I adjust or change. Has this been a problem for anybody else? I've tried creating new projects, using various texts and expressions. Never had this problem in any other time signature. What could this be?
Any help is appreciated!
Thanks!
So I'm arranging a 12/8 blues for big band and no matter what I do, human playback doesn't swing. 8th and 16th notes come out straight no matter what I adjust or change. Has this been a problem for anybody else? I've tried creating new projects, using various texts and expressions. Never had this problem in any other time signature. What could this be?
Any help is appreciated!
Thanks!
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- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:59 pm
- Finale Version: 25
- Operating System: Mac
Audio or visual sample?
- miker
- Posts: 6009
- Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:28 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 27.4
- Operating System: Mac
I suspect it's because in 12/8, the default breakdown is 4, dotted quarters. And so, Finale is putting the accent on the dotted quarters: one-and-a, two-and-a... and trying to combine that with a two eighths=quarter/eighth triplet.
If you set the tempo as 6, quarter notes, displaying as 12/8, the swing is fine, but you lose the accents. I don't know enough theory to go beyond that!
If you set the tempo as 6, quarter notes, displaying as 12/8, the swing is fine, but you lose the accents. I don't know enough theory to go beyond that!
Finale 27 | SmartScorePro 64
Mac OS 13.2.1 Ventura
Copyist for Barbershop Harmony Society
Mac OS 13.2.1 Ventura
Copyist for Barbershop Harmony Society
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
A Finale file is what we need. 12/8 is basically swing written out, so quarter followed by 8th gives you swing. That's why I am wondering what the file looks like to assess what the real problem is. I'm scratching my head meanwhile.
Zuill
Zuill
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
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- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:59 pm
- Finale Version: 25
- Operating System: Mac
Here's the file (forgive the roughness/incompleteness I only just started it and the swing issue has distracted me from adding things or patching things up.) Lemme know what you think! The sort of beat I was looking for is like a standard 12/8 blues ride pattern with that ever so slight 16th note swing (1 2 and 3 4 5 6 7 8 and 9 10 11 12). Here's the track I've been using for reference for you to get a better idea of what I mean:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLFlMbyA0r8
Thanks a million for all your help, gang!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLFlMbyA0r8
Thanks a million for all your help, gang!
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
Just needed some tweaking.
Zuill
P.S.: Your profile says you are using Finale 2012, but this is a Finale 25 file. You might want to update your profile.
Zuill
P.S.: Your profile says you are using Finale 2012, but this is a Finale 25 file. You might want to update your profile.
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
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- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:59 pm
- Finale Version: 25
- Operating System: Mac
Oh awesome! Thank you so much! May I ask exactly what you tweaked? And yes, I'll update!
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
First, I changed the meter to be 12/8 as 12 single eighths as opposed to compound meter. I kept the option to show as compound under the false assumption that would keep the beams in groups of threes. I was wrong. So, just create the meter as 12 8ths as simple meter. You'll have to rebeam to compound meter 12/8 later. Lot's of extra work. You can enter all the music first in compound meter, then change the meter to simple 12/8 just to get the correct playback. that might save work.
Now, you need to change the Score List 1 (that's the Score List used for the Swing expression you are using) to have all the staves selected under the parts list. You can choose not to select the bass staff of the piano if the grand staff is sharing a channel.
Lastly, change the definition of the swing playback in the expression for Swing you are using to have the swing set to 50 instead of 100. When swing 16ths, the normal value is cut in half.
Zuill
Now, you need to change the Score List 1 (that's the Score List used for the Swing expression you are using) to have all the staves selected under the parts list. You can choose not to select the bass staff of the piano if the grand staff is sharing a channel.
Lastly, change the definition of the swing playback in the expression for Swing you are using to have the swing set to 50 instead of 100. When swing 16ths, the normal value is cut in half.
Zuill
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
- motet
- Posts: 8276
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I confess to not really following what swung 12/8 is, but won't Utilities/Rebeam/Rebeam to Time Signature accomplish it without a lot of extra work?zuill wrote:You'll have to rebeam to compound meter 12/8 later. Lot's of extra work.
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
That's what I meant. That's not really a lot of extra work. I just meant that getting the swing for 16ths adds steps not normally needed. For you and me not too much, but for some it might be daunting.
Zuill
Zuill
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."