Cannot use a tempo alteration more than once
Moderators: Peter Thomsen, miker
- Djard
- Posts: 921
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:23 am
- Finale Version: Finale 26
- Operating System: Windows
I assigned rall. to a part in my score. It plays back correctly. I assign the same expression later in the score and Finale ignores the tempo alteration. After resigning to the fact that any one of the countless bugs in Finale is going to surface if I write music beyond elementary level, I discovered that I can get around the problem by duplicating an unused rit., changing the name to rall. and then entering it into the score. So each time I need to enter a rall., I must make another duplicate of the rit. and call it rall.
Nothing in Document Options, Preferences or HP that I can see that appears amiss. And I did clear all expressions, articulations as well as the MIDI data in the measure then re-wrote the notation. Any idea why playback of tempo alterations fails if I use the expression more than once?
Nothing in Document Options, Preferences or HP that I can see that appears amiss. And I did clear all expressions, articulations as well as the MIDI data in the measure then re-wrote the notation. Any idea why playback of tempo alterations fails if I use the expression more than once?
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
Normally, in 2012, the same expression can be used more than once and get the same playback effect. In the attached document, the rall. works both times.
So, the problem is not with Finale itself, but with something in the file that is interfering with the rall. expression.
Zuill
So, the problem is not with Finale itself, but with something in the file that is interfering with the rall. expression.
Zuill
- Attachments
-
- Rallentando Demo.mus
- (41.47 KiB) Downloaded 195 times
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
- Djard
- Posts: 921
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:23 am
- Finale Version: Finale 26
- Operating System: Windows
I regard Finale modifying tempo alterations without me making any changes to the settings as a bug. Attached is the score. I left the stubbornly imposed reverb on as it only comes back, despite saving the document with it set to fully dry (another bug, which I am learning to tolerate).
When I write music for orchestral instruments that is not individually polyphonic or contains many expressions, lines, shapes and articulations, Finale behaves itself quite well. The problems I experience are only elicited by complex notation.
I hope someone can help me solve the riddle of why a rall. and rit. cannot be used more than once in this piece. Thank you all in advance for your patience.
When I write music for orchestral instruments that is not individually polyphonic or contains many expressions, lines, shapes and articulations, Finale behaves itself quite well. The problems I experience are only elicited by complex notation.
I hope someone can help me solve the riddle of why a rall. and rit. cannot be used more than once in this piece. Thank you all in advance for your patience.
- Attachments
-
- Romance en Aranjuez (Gerárdo).mus
- (149.24 KiB) Downloaded 189 times
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
Okay, I see that you have 2 rall. expressions. One is set to playback shape 0, and the other to shape 6. If you want 2 different playback effects, that's one way to do it. So, one does need to have 2 different shapes for 2 different playback effects.
So, what is the need? Or am I misunderstanding the problem?
Zuill
So, what is the need? Or am I misunderstanding the problem?
Zuill
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
That's because the shapes use an old convoluted system that is interacting with the HP method, and because the starting and stopping tempos are different.
If you create a rall. without a shape definition, and let HP do its own thing, then the rall. works about the same in both spots.
If I wanted precise control, I would avoid the archaic shape playback method, and enter the exact MIDI data.
Zuill
If you create a rall. without a shape definition, and let HP do its own thing, then the rall. works about the same in both spots.
If I wanted precise control, I would avoid the archaic shape playback method, and enter the exact MIDI data.
Zuill
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
- Djard
- Posts: 921
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:23 am
- Finale Version: Finale 26
- Operating System: Windows
I duplicated a functional rall. but playback failed when used used as a copy. Hm.
Riten. works; but if I enter it and rename is as rall., playback of tempo alteration fails. So just renaming the expression disables playback. Finale is soooo flaky. If the next version is more stable, I will definitely upgrade. Since only rarely do I experience problems when writing for orchestra, I am convinced version 2012c is not for classical guitarists.
To avoid losing more time, I resolved my problem by using the tempo tap tool and adding rall. as text.
Riten. works; but if I enter it and rename is as rall., playback of tempo alteration fails. So just renaming the expression disables playback. Finale is soooo flaky. If the next version is more stable, I will definitely upgrade. Since only rarely do I experience problems when writing for orchestra, I am convinced version 2012c is not for classical guitarists.
To avoid losing more time, I resolved my problem by using the tempo tap tool and adding rall. as text.
- zuill
- Posts: 4418
- Joined: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:35 pm
- Finale Version: Finale 2011-v26.3.1
- Operating System: Windows
I am guessing that we use different settings for the rall. I got the same one to work in multiple places. So, each user gets different results because each user defines the rall differently. I don't think updating to a newer version will make a difference, as the same approach will yield the same result. So you're probably better off sticking with 2012. Apply what would be the upgrade price to a nice night out at a fancy restaurant. Finale works much the same way in v25 as it did in 2012 when it comes to HP playback.
Zuill
Zuill
Windows 10, Finale 2011-v26.3.1
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
- Djard
- Posts: 921
- Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 2:23 am
- Finale Version: Finale 26
- Operating System: Windows
I can repeatedly insert a tempo alteration, like rall. or rit. in other documents. The problem I describe occurs mainly in this one document that has a lot of tempo shifts. It seems that the more complex the notation, the more likely Finale is to manifest a problem. I'm at the point where I look forward to writing for any instrument but guitar.
Maybe I can find an affordable musical amenuensis, but an apéritif du caviar Belugan and dinner of roast pheasant alla fiorentina, washed down with a glass of Chateau Mouton Rothschild 1945, would be a fair substitute. Would truffes au chocolat noir and coffee from the finest Colombian Arabica beans offer a perfect cadence to the dinner?
Maybe I can find an affordable musical amenuensis, but an apéritif du caviar Belugan and dinner of roast pheasant alla fiorentina, washed down with a glass of Chateau Mouton Rothschild 1945, would be a fair substitute. Would truffes au chocolat noir and coffee from the finest Colombian Arabica beans offer a perfect cadence to the dinner?
- David Ward
- Posts: 815
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:48 pm
- Finale Version: F 25.5 & 26.3
- Operating System: Mac
Sounds like the sort of dinner that I used to be taken out to by a very grand kinsman in my long ago student days…Djard wrote:… … but an apéritif du caviar Belugan and dinner of roast pheasant alla fiorentina, washed down with a glass of Chateau Mouton Rothschild 1945, would be a fair substitute. Would truffes au chocolat noir and coffee from the finest Colombian Arabica beans offer a perfect cadence to the dinner?
Finale 25.5 & 26.3
Mac 10.13.6 & 10.14.6
Mac 10.13.6 & 10.14.6